rofish

JR 77, Be careful, equal amount of each part of Devcon 2 ton refers to volume, not to weight. If you want to measure by weight, then follow the producer's instructions (click to download tech data sheet): http://www.devcon.com/products/products.cfm?family=2%20Ton%C2%AE%20Clear%20Epoxy

V-man, Sorry, I didn’t study fluids, and I’m not an engineer. I just have some ideas, based on my feeling about how a hunting action could be done. But I do not have the necessary time to experiment. Up to know, I have made just one crank bait that hunts, and I guess the action is related somehow to the 2 step lip the lure has. But further on, there are a lot of variables in the lip itself (the lip has 2 angles, which can vary, the lengths of the 3 parts of the lip can vary as well, also the angle of the lip, or the angle of the lip slot may be different, etc). I have not even tried yet to duplicate that lure, and I do not know if its action could be viewed as a hunting one. The crank bait would go to one side a little, then come back at the center for 1-2 seconds, then go to the other side, and come back again to the center, and so on. I do not know if anyone would consider such action as a hunting one. As I have noticed so far, there is no a totally agreed upon action that could be considered as a hunting one. Some would say that a badly tuned crank bait will have a hunting action. BobP explained in his post very well this situation. That lure is on the edge of instability, as he says. It is very simple to make such a lure. You only have to make the lure not perfect. For instance, if the lip has a slight angle to the left or right, you can achieve an action much like the action of a badly injured fish. You can use such a crank bait at low speed only, because at high speed it will blow out. But if I find a way to constantly achieve an action which is not “true”, and couldn’t be even considered as a “hunting” one, I will surely post my findings here.

LaPala, I think the explanation is very simple. Dave knows very well about one way to achieve the hunting action, but if they are more, he would like to know them all. Just professional curiosity, as he says ...

No, this has never happened to me. The only logical explanation I can find for this is that I do not have access to a pool.

I have found a method not to be at the mercy of ambient temperatures. After mixing the epoxy, which I always thin, I use hot air over the mixture to make it more fluid. You can see the air bubbles changing their mood, being more willing to find their way out of the epoxy. Also, I use hot air over the freshly epoxied crankbait, to be sure that any air bubble, even very small ones, will leave the epoxy.

More options: 1) Use aluminum lips which you keep shiny (if you do not want to make them shiny every time before fishing, you just apply a coat of epoxy on them when they are the shiniest) 2) Silver paint + epoxy 3) The brightest aluminum tape on the market, glued to the lip, and coated with epoxy. Anyway, if you notice any change in the rate of strikes, please do tell us. Some might be interested.

Nitro, See if you can adapt this idea to your needs. I designed this lure holder to be used for brushing epoxy onto swimbaits, but I haven't tried it yet. I'm too lazy, I think. The wire is hard tempered steel wire, so it acts like a spring, pulling the lure from both ends, so the swimbait could stay in a straight position while brushing the epoxy on. You cannot dip a lure in epoxy, because it is to thick for this purpose, and you will also have to throw away a lot from the mixture. So you have to brush the epoxy on, just before you put the lure on the drying wheel.If your swimbait does not have a wire eye at the very end of the tail, as your picture shows, you could think of adding a small (short) wire eye, which you could eliminate after clearcoating. But I'm not expert at all in making swimbaits, so I think you could ask Mark Poulson or others for some guidelines in this respect. http://s84.photobucket.com/albums/k5/rofish_2006/rofish_2006-4/?action=view&current=wirelureholder003.jpg&newest=1

It all depends on what your goal is. I was trying to explain how you could get rid of the bubbles which you see under the clearcoat. D2T has a great advantage as a clearcoat, and that is the fact that it can level out the surface very well. So if you apply first a coat of epoxy, before you put any paint on the lure, you will have a perfectly smooth surface to paint on. And do not fear that epoxy will not bridge the gaps created by the microballoons, especially if you thin a little bit the epoxy before brushing it on, and on condition that you heat the lure before applying the epoxy. Even if the epoxy will not be able to reach the bottom of each individual tiny hole, which I doubt, the fact that the air which could be trapped in these holes is warm, meaning expanded in volume,will determine that once the temperature of the lure decreases, the volume of the air will also decrease. But the fact that you also hit the lure with heat right after brushing the epoxy on, will soften the epoxy, making it more fluid, and therefore enabling any air bubbles to escape from it. So the air bubbles are not linked to the paint or to an improper mixing of D2T. Once fully cured, you can lightly sand the surface of the epoxy, so the paint could better adhere on it. And you have there a perfect surface to paint on, without any fear that bubbles might show up. The problem with the epoxy not liking to cover sharp edges is real and well known. Follow Mark Poulson's instructions and you will have no such problems in future.

Nitro 98, In my opinion, your problem with the air bubbles showing under the clearcoat is due to the changing of temperature the swimbait is subject to. Air will expand at higher temperature, and will encounter weak resistance from the paint, if any, then it will be stopped in its way out by the epoxy clearcoat. To prevent this from happening, I can think of 2 solutions: 1) Seal the lure with epoxy before painting it 2) Heat the lure and the epoxy when applying the clearcoat. But I think that in both cases it is better to heat the lure and the epoxy when sealing or clearcoating it. Don't know how much temperature the alumilite can withstand, but try to use heat for the lure before applying epoxy to it. I also use a hair drier to heat the epoxy after mixing it. And after clearcoating, before rotating the lure, I heat the lure again with the drier, and this operation will take out any air bubbles which might still exist in the epoxy.

Atrophius, I have some experience in using propionate as a sealer and as a topcoat. First, let me tell you that propionate solution will not adhere very well on metals, so do not expect to have a perfect bond between the propionate coat and aluminium foil. I do use aluminium foil on crankbaits and sometimes I use propionate solution as topcoat, but it is a very particular case here. I make photofinish crankbaits, which means I glue the thin paper with the image on it to aluminium foil, which then I glue to the lure. Propionate solution will adhere in this case to the thin paper, which is very well glued to the aluminium foil. Actually, the solution goes through the paper and bonds to the glue itself, which is a contact glue (the kind you have to apply a thin layer of it on both parts to be glued, wait a few minutes until it dries out, then press the 2 parts together). So in such cases I do not have headaches about the possibility of propionate coat peeling off the aluminium foil. If some of the scales on your lure have come off it, this might be explained by an improper glue you have probably used, or to the fact that not all the surface of the lure and of the foil have been covered by a thin layer of glue. Of course, this could also be explained by the fact that the glue you have used may have been dissolved by acetone. Try to use contact glue for such jobs in the future. I also have had some bad experiences with self adhesive foil. The glue which is used on it will be dissolved by acetone and the foil will lift up at the edges. You can solve this problem by shooting a few very thin layers of propionate solution through your airbrush. The acetone will evaporate before having the time to lift off the foil. I have not tried it yet, since I haven't used an airbrush up to now ( ) but I remember that Palmetto Balsa did this with good results, this time to prevent the paint to run. After a few coats of propionate through your airbrush, you can continue your final clearcoat by dipping the lure as many times as you want, because the paint is already protected by the first coats applied through the airbrush. PhilB is right, acetone evaporates very fast, which may cause the "blushing" of the clearcoat. To prevent this, I use a thinner instead of acetone, having a longer evaporation time. Due to wrinkles of the foil or the glue not being spread uniformly on the lure, the surface of it will not be very smooth, so I prefer to put thinned epoxy as the first clearcoat, which will level out very well, then I continue the clearcoating process by about 20 coats of propionate solution. Hope this helps.

Don't know what happened with images 2 and 5. Here I try again http://s84.photobucket.com/albums/k5/rofish_2006/?action=view&current=throughwire02.jpg&newest=1 http://s84.photobucket.com/albums/k5/rofish_2006/?action=view&current=throughwire05.jpg&newest=1

Pikester, I ran into the same problems as you did (lack of patience, maybe some laziness ? Now, I am sure you would like to shape and sand a blank without having to bother about wire eyes, wouldn't you? So here's how I do it in the case of a through wire blank. 1) This will be a very small crankbait, only 4 cm in length (about 1 1/2 "), to which I will put only one treble hook. If there are 2 trebles, or even 3, the process should be the same. Here are the 2 halves. The wood is almost as light as balsa. http://s84.photobucket.com/albums/k5/rofish_2006/?action=view&current=throughwire01.jpg&newest=1 2) The through wire http://s84.photobucket.com/albums/k5/rofish_2006/?action=view&current=throughwire01.jpg&newest=1 3) Keeping the wire sandwiched, I put the blank in a small vise, and press the 2 halves together. Channels from the wire will form in the 2 halves http://s84.photobucket.com/albums/k5/rofish_2006/?action=view&current=throughwire03.jpg&newest=1 4) To better see the channels, I mark them with a pen, then I enlarge the channels using a milling (I guess) to be used on a rotary power tool, Dremel type. Too much fuss about installing the power tool, so I get quicker results if I use the small tool by hand http://s84.photobucket.com/albums/k5/rofish_2006/?action=view&current=throughwire04.jpg&newest=1 5) Keeping the 2 halves together in the vise, I drill 2 holes, with a diameter slightly smaller than the diameter of a toothpick. After inserting the toothpicks, the blank will look like this http://s84.photobucket.com/albums/k5/rofish_2006/?action=view&current=throughwire04.jpg&newest=1 6) I cut the toothpicks flush with the wood, take the 2 halves apart, and the toothpicks will remain in one half (it may also be the case that each half has that piece of toothpick in it). I round off the edge of the toothpick at the top, by sanding a little bit, so that when I put the halves together the toothpick is somehow selfcentered into the opposite holes. Here you can see that one of the holes is a little bit too close to the channel for the wire, but I checked it out, and everything fits well. http://s84.photobucket.com/albums/k5/rofish_2006/?action=view&current=throughwire06.jpg&newest=1 Next I have to cut the lipslot and make a hole for the lead, either horizontally or vertically. Being so small, this crankbait requires just a small amount of weight. And now I can shape and sand the blank much easier than if I had glued the wire before shaping. The 2 pieces of toothpicks will keep the 2 halves together in the same position. After sanding, you can glue the wire between the 2 halves, and go on from here, without having to worry about having sanded the wire as well. For big crankbaits, you could just adapt the idea (more toothpicks ? ) I tried to attach images, but it didn't work for me, so I had to upload images on photobucket first.

Pikester, I can only guess that 0.5 mm ss sheet would not be the best material to use for the lips on large crankbaits. Just my feeling, On the other hand, I think you should try it at least once, to see how it works. And you have a great advantage here. You can bend the lip as you like, to see how it will affect the action of the lure.

Pikester, Diemai knows very well what he is saying, because he works in this field, and he has made many fishing spoons. I also made many in line spinners, still making some, but I used 0.5 mm ss sheet for the blade, and also copper and brass sheet with the same thickness. I can tell you that I can cut copper or brass sheet much easier than I can cut ss sheet. Still, cutting out shapes of 0.5 mm ss sheet is a job for tin snips. And I think you do not need thicker ss sheet for the lips, because they are very heavy, and difficult to process. So maybe you have some luck again, and go across some 0.5 mm ss sheet?

Diemai, After I posted my thoughts, the idea of the lure starting to work on retrieve with the nose downwards, because of the pressure the water creates on the lip, actually crossed my mind. So because of this phenomenon, the balls will be able to roll down from the rear end to the front end of the fragmented hole. It seems we think the same, only that I'm a little bit slower ... Anyway, I think that what you must achieve with this new design, is that while the lure sits still in the water, having the ballast at the rear end, at least the front of the lip should be submerged, so that when you start retrieving it, the lip could "bite" into the water, thus allowing the lip to push the lure downwards. Thanks.

Diemai, I very much appreciate your ideas and your ways to build something new in this field. I might also try to rig hooks at the top of the crankbait. But to this new model of lure, with 2 holes that meet in the center at a certain angle, I do not understand something. Once the lure hits the water, and lays horizontally, how will those pellets (balls) go upwards first, to be able to roll downwards after, towards the lower part of the belly? Or are they meant to permanently stay at the rear of the lure?

Vman, I think you have just scared off a newcomer on TU , even if you are right about what you said. Let him first be "bitten" by such a nice passion, then you can explain to him the construction of lures in a truly scientific way. I chose the ballast for each crankbait. First, I install the hardware, leaving one or 2 holes for the lead (depending on the size of the lure) at the bottom of the belly, near the belly hook hanger. Then 5-6 dips in propionate solution will seal the lure, including the interior of the holes. This might be tricky, as you have to fill the holes first, using a toothpick or similar to take the air out, then you have to take out the propionate solution. I put the treble hooks on the lure, then I choose the buoyancy of the lure in a pot of water using different lengths of cylindrical lead which fit into the holes. I press them about half way into the holes, so I could be able to remove them and put in other lengths (and therefore weights) if necessary. What I am after is that a certain part of the lure stays above the water (around 1/3). I can play with different weights. After choosing the right ballast, I dry the lure, glue the weights in ( CA glue, or sometimes no glue at all, if I have to press hard the lead into the hole). Close the holes with 2 part epoxy putty, which can be sanded smoothly after it has fully cured. Then I would dip the lure another 4-5 times (so it is also sealed in the area where the weight is). I find this method easier than if I had to become an engineer first, to be able to build lures afterward. And I never fail about the right amount of weight, using this method.

Let me guess. You have glued those scales one by one ? I think this would be a truly new way to make a lure. I reckon I would be a little scared to try it. At first, I thought it was a photo finish.

Pikester, 1) Here's a simple method for a deep penetration of the wood using propionate solution, if you want to try it. The solution has to have the consistency of milk (more or less). Keep the wooden lure submerged for about 1 week in propionate solution. To do this, you can find many ways. For instance, you can make a coil of wire between the lid of the jar and the lure at the bottom of the jar. Any method is good as long as it keeps the lure submerged. See what happens, and see if you can dry up the lure completely. 2) If you are after big pikes, balsa wood is not the best choice, I think, and I also think that there are others here thinking this way. 3) I make photofinish crankbaits. There are bumps at the surface, due to the fact that the contact glue I use dries up too fast, and the foil has many wrinkles, which I cannot smooth out completely. One coat of thinned Devcon 2T is usually enough to level out the surface, but if it isn't, I would sand the epoxy, thus helping the second layer of thinned epoxy to do its job - perfectly leveling out the surface. Tref, You don't know this, but a similar discussion about celluloid went here some years ago. People do not seem to know what celluloid is, because it was one of the first plastics ever created, and it is no longer in use for many years now, except for table tennis balls perhaps. I remember that combs used to be made out of celluloid at the time when I was a child. Celluloid burns out quickly if fire is put on it. I would also like to try celluloid, but cannot find it anymore. I would like to have the clear variety, not the white or orange one (I have not seen clear table tennis balls yet). Hope you do not live in Romania, as I do ....