clemmy Posted January 12, 2008 Report Share Posted January 12, 2008 I know you can't legally sell titanium spinnerbaits due to trademark, but has anyone heard of a wire bait tungsten trademark? I just wanted to make sure before I spent the time developing an idea... Thanks, Clemmy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Munkin Posted January 12, 2008 Report Share Posted January 12, 2008 You can sell titanium spinnerbaits just Terminator gets a cut of your profits. Allen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clemmy Posted January 13, 2008 Author Report Share Posted January 13, 2008 not that that answers my question at all, but you are correct only if you've negotiated a price point with them. What did you work out with them Munkin? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Munkin Posted January 13, 2008 Report Share Posted January 13, 2008 Didn't mean to come off as a a**hole there? I do not like Titanium so I would not look into it. Wouldn't tunsten be to hard of a metal? Allen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clemmy Posted January 14, 2008 Author Report Share Posted January 14, 2008 No Worries, I probably wasn't clear enough. I meant using tungsten as the weight for a wire bait, not for the wire. There's several already being made, but I don't know if anyone had previously patented and is lisc. them out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spike-A-Pike Posted January 14, 2008 Report Share Posted January 14, 2008 I wouldn't think you could patent a "material" that is on the periodic table. A process or item using tungsten, but not the name. I wasn't aware the that high temperatur aircarft material (titanium) was patented or copyrighted... What a goofy world. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sagacious Posted January 14, 2008 Report Share Posted January 14, 2008 ... has anyone heard of a wire bait tungsten trademark? Not sure if the use of tungsten in spinnerbaits is patented. The ones on the market are expensive-- but it's unclear if that is due to perceived novelty, manufacturing costs, or a higher retail price that covers licensing royalties. Is there a manufacturer out there that says they sell "the original tungsten spinnerbait"? I wouldn't think you could patent a "material" that is on the periodic table. A process or item using tungsten, but not the name. I wasn't aware the that high temperatur aircarft material (titanium) was patented or copyrighted... What a goofy world. What materials aren't on the periodic table? You got it right-- it's the novel use of the material to 'improve' an existing product; for example, the use of Ti wire in a spinnerbait. Heck, Leo Szliard patented the nuclear chain reaction, how crazy is that? That's a fundamental behavior of matter... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodkaman Posted January 14, 2008 Report Share Posted January 14, 2008 Tungsten is used in a few lure names, I found one called 'tungsten vibe'. Whether it is copyrighted or not, who knows. You should be able to use the word 'titanium' in a lure name, (opinion). I was thinking the same as Bruce, how can you patent or copyright the name of an element, it's just silly. As a foot note, both of these metals are amongst the most difficult to work with. I NEVER want to have to drill a hole in titanium ever again! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoadToad Posted January 16, 2008 Report Share Posted January 16, 2008 What materials aren't on the periodic table? Those that are not elements. Steel, for example. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sagacious Posted January 17, 2008 Report Share Posted January 17, 2008 I wouldn't think you could patent a "material" that is on the periodic table. What materials aren't[/i'] on the periodic table? Those that are not elements. Steel, for example. Yes, of course. For discussion purposes relative to patent law, the "materials" we're concerned with here are chemical elements-- such as iron in a steel alloy, titanium in a nickel-titanium spinnerbait frame, or tungsten in tungsten alloy spinnerbaits. When the first tungsten filament lightbulbs were invented, they were patented. The "material" wasn't patented per se, but the use of it in lightbulbs was. The only restriction (that I've seen) of the use of the word "tungsten" as applied to spinnerbaits is the line of Tru-Tungsten® spinnerbaits. Has anyone else seen any tungsten spinnerbaits that show trademarks, patents, or restrictions? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delw Posted January 17, 2008 Report Share Posted January 17, 2008 We looked into this a bunch of years ago for one of our customers, since I deal with aerospace alloys, I talked to several of my metal suppliers. The way I understood it is that. The titanium wire you can make spinner baits out of however, Strike king has there own wire specially made that is patented. you cannot use their wire to make the baits with out paying them for it or that particular titanium. Straight out titanium is a pain to work with and very hard to bend, when you heat it, it generally snaps. There was one guy on this board that was able to bend it successfully. I believe there is a post on it somewhere in the archives if it didnt get lost when the server went down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sagacious Posted January 17, 2008 Report Share Posted January 17, 2008 ... The titanium wire you can make spinner baits out of however, Strike king has there own wire specially made that is patented. you cannot use their wire to make the baits with out paying them for it or that particular titanium. ... Yes, as I'm sure you know, some companies are using the nickel-titanium "superalloys" to make spinnerbaits that 'snap-back' and don't require tuning, and others use different alloys marketed as "tuneable titanium". As always, the devil's in the details. Titanium can be a bear to work with, as Vodkaman noted with his hole-drilling tribulations. I've worked with both titanium and tungsten, and it can indeed be a real chore. Patent or no, tungsten spinnerbaits doesn't seem like a much easier prospect. Maybe we need some other exotic metal lures. I've got some exotic metals lying around, maybe I'll whip-up the next new fad: the niobium-wire spinnerbait! Now don't try to scoop me on this! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delw Posted January 17, 2008 Report Share Posted January 17, 2008 Yes, as I'm sure you know, some companies are using the nickel-titanium "superalloys" to make spinnerbaits that 'snap-back' and don't require tuning, and others use different alloys marketed as "tuneable titanium". As always, the devil's in the details.Titanium can be a bear to work with, as Vodkaman noted with his hole-drilling tribulations. I've worked with both titanium and tungsten, and it can indeed be a real chore. Patent or no, tungsten spinnerbaits doesn't seem like a much easier prospect. Maybe we need some other exotic metal lures. I've got some exotic metals lying around, maybe I'll whip-up the next new fad: the niobium-wire spinnerbait! Now don't try to scoop me on this! Yup exactly. Tit is workable if you run it slow with heavy feeds( machining wise) one wire you might want to look into is Monel its a nickle based alloy and does have some bending charactoristics at least it does going 2500rpms and comming out of the collet LOL. it also has some nice weight to it. I run alot of monel. we used to get it for 10 bucks a lb when it was high. I just got a quote for 5 3/8" dia bars 12 foot random blanks 950 bucks, it used to cost under 250 bucks for 10 bars... I run 400-500 bars a year normally I use 1/4" but they dont make that / or have it anymore. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spike-A-Pike Posted January 17, 2008 Report Share Posted January 17, 2008 The way most things are going in the world today, nothing is cheap any more. As all metals become more expensive, maybe it is time to start pushing in new areas to better uses for current resources and new uses for those yet to be discovered. The main use for titanium in my mind has always been extreme heat situations like the hot section of a jet engine. The only reason for drilling titanium was to stop-drill a crack. Depending on the size of the crack and if it was a single ply area, that may be all the repair required. I also remember one young not so bright airman writing his name in pencil lead to see if it would really burn a hole through a titanium afterburner (yes, it did and it only cost him about $22,000.00 to find out). I recently saw a show on TV where a company on the west coast has started to build a green bike build out of steamed bamboo, glue, and twine. It does use a few metal bearings in key locations. The bike wieghs close to the current high-tech versions being used for Toure de France. So, maybe that is the nature of the challenge we need to start looking at... How to build better lures that are better than anything made today. Wouldn't it be great if by adding a few drops of a safe, cheap, additive to an old milk jug, we could have a rust free material as strong as steel, that puts off a perfect fish attracting vibration that we could finish or paint in any of a hundred different ways. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
