Question about old ambassadeur reels....

[68KingFisher]

After many years away from fishing I have started again.....I purchased a BPS spinning combo rig and a few lures to me going started, but a friend recently gave me a couple of old Abu's on rods that he never used.....an ambassadeur 5000 on a 7ft Berkley lightning rod IM6 series, and a 5500-C3 mounted on a 6.5ft All Star rod....WR1 model i'm assuming?

I learned how to use a baitcast reel in the early 80's and spent many years using a low profile Shimano reel.....but I know nothing about these round types of baitcasters, and I was hoping someone could give me some more info on them....specificly, are they worth my time to use them fishing for bass? The ser# looks to be(89-0 89-90)on the 5000, and(990503)on the 5500-C3.

They both cleaned up pretty nice and i relubed them, before stringin them up with some 15lb Berkly BigGame line. I gave both reels a try at a nearby lake last weekend. First off I wasn't crazy about the "Solar" BigGame line....it looked like a big honkin ski rope coming thru the water.....lol.....So i'll might use something different if I keep on using these.....In fact, Should I be using a braided line on these reels?

The 5000 gave me the most trouble with backlashing and tryin to adjust that......I just couldn't seem to find a happy medium that worked for me.....I could make some short flippin style casts but any long cast resulted in a backlash.....I was tryin jig-n-pig...worms...and spinnerbaits.

The 5500 did alot better and I was able to make some fairly long sidearm casts without much effort......the reel felt solid and smooth for the most part, although the round body felt fairly large, and for some reason, I kept wrapping a finger around the front and getting it pinched by the line guide as I held the reel with my left hand....lol....I guess time will break that habit.....I did have my share of backlashing with this reel also.... but not near as bad, and I blame much of that on my needing practice as I do on the older style of spool control system....and my not being used to it.....the Shimano I learned with had a magnetic spool control.

Anyway, i'd love to hear what other bass fisherman think about using these.....Are they worth using, or should I bring them out for catfish night?

PS.....I understand there are some upgradable features on one or both of these reels.....would adding the upgrades be worth my time or money, or should I use save that money for a newer reel? The rods seem nice enough to keep them no matter what reels I end up using.....in fact if any of you can give me more info the rods also i'd really appreciate it.

Thanks in advance for sharing your knowledge.

Edited July 25, 2008 by 68KingFisher

[thedude]

oldschoolbasser is the authority on ambassador's here.. i'm sure he'll be able to help you fine tune/troubleshoot them.

I haven't used one of those in years, but they are decent reels, just get them tuned up right.

[Spike-A-Pike]

I am never comfortable with bait casters - I have 1 for my musky rod - but I don't like them. I would probably see if I could find any more info on them, like an owner's manual, and see if I could detect what the tweaks may have been.

The Dude was right though, oldschoolbasser is the authority on Ambassadors. You may want to email or PM.

[-mike-]

Bait casters ARE THE TOOL for most any fishing. Problem is ya need a good one.

Not that the Ambassadors arent good- they just arent as good as most any shimano out of the box. Yes- bearings and bushings can be changed and swapped, but that isnt free and you need a small bit of aptitude to pull it off.

Find out how much you'll have in getting these reels up to snuff, then compare that to the cost of a new one, then make your choice- Mike.

FWIW, a souped up ambassador aint a bad reel at all.

[BobP]

You'll get mostly personal opinions on this, and here's mine:

The Ambassadeurs are solid reels IF they fit your style of fishing and you are comfortable using them. But reel that you can't trust not to backlash isn't much fun to fish with. The 5000/5500's aren't noted for great cast controls, nor for long casts - but there are a zillion of them around and they still have fans. They do best with heavy line and heavy lures. Me, I'd only use one for trolling There are much better reels around nowadays if you're casting for bass.

I've reconditioned some Ambassadeur Pro Max 1600 and 3600 reels from the late 60's and early 70's and love using them. They are round 8.5 oz reels - much smaller and lighter than a 5000/5500, so they palm nicely. They have better cast controls and the Promax has 6 internal bearings. Cast/retrieve like a dream and are actually HARD to backlash. They were a top line model for Ambassadeur "way back when" and sold for $169 (a pretty penny in 1969-1971!).

There's a linear relationship between quality and cost, up to the mid-range models in each company's reel lineup. After that, you pay a premium for fewer and fewer added features. If you want a low profile, fairly light baitcaster I recommend buying from a large reel company and not a "house brand" from BassPro or Cabelas, etc. The big boys stand behind and produce a more reliable reel. If it breaks 5 yrs from now, parts will be available and you can get it fixed. If there are internal upgrades or fixes to the model, factory service centers will usually add them at no charge during repair service.

I don't claim to have fished all the mid-range reels but have seen good reports on these:

> Abu Garcia Revo S - $109

> Shimano Citica CI100DSV - $119

Whatever brand catches your fancy, I'd get a reel with an aluminum frame. 4-5 bearings are good. More MAY be smoother but beware, some second tier manufacturers stuff mediocre reels with low quality bearings as a marketing gimmick.

Braid - It doesn't cast better or worse than other lines. It has excellent sensitivity but fish can see it in clear water. I use it for Carolina rigs and when fishing heavy grass cover. Otherwise, I favor a copolymer or fluorocarbon line. If you use braid, be sure to spool some copolymer line as backing first, then tie the braid to it. If you tie braid directly on the spool, it will slip under pressure and you'll think your reel's drag is broken. Besides, you'll need backing to fill up the reel since most braid comes in 125 yd spools.

[oldschoolbasser]

Being a fan of the older Ambassadeur reels,there are a lot of ways to make them smoother,and better casting.Lets start with the 5000.First off this is a bushing reel and not as smooth as a bearing reel.A simple solution to your backlashing problem would be to change the brake blocks on the spool.There are 3 different sizes available.Ambassadeur part #1880(small size) #1881 (large),and #1884(medium).If your brake blocks are too small,you won't get as wide a selection of braking as you would with a larger brake block.Another thing to remember is bushing reels work better with heavier lures,and don't handle light lures as well as a bearing reel.Your reel can be converted to a bearing reel,but a number of parts need to be changed in order to do the conversion.I suggest you try larger brake blocks first to see if this helps with the backlash problem.If this helps,and you still want a better casting reel,I would go with the dual bearing worm gear,and bearing supported cog wheel.As for the 5500C,I would go with ABEC5 bearings for smoothness,and increased casting distance.I'd also go with the worm gear,and cog wheel upgrades.If you need any help email me at jchinsr@gmail.com,or call me @(626)235-5598 and i'll be happy to help you out.There is 1 more conversion that i've done to some reels,and that is converting them to a narrower size reel which makes them a little more comfortable to fish with.

[68KingFisher]

Thank you all for your replys......OldSchoolBasser, I'll be droppin you an email in the near future. I think I want to upgrade the 5500C to ball bearings but i'll probably leave the 5000 alone at this time. I'm planning on purchasing a newer style baitcaster soon, I'm just not sure what brand or model i'll get at this time....i'm just a poor boy and a tightwad ta boot, so it'll be a reel in the $100 range or less.....I just can't justify spending more than that.....at least not right now. I was honestly leaning towards something from BPS but after reading what BobP had to say, I may need to reconsider.....I dunno.....i've got one of their Mega tournament spincast combos that I like real well, but i've only fished with it a half dozen times or so.....granted I fish hard with it, but who knows how it'll hold up down the road a year or two....but for $40 it's not to hard to replace......I'd love to hear what others think about BPS reels also.....Thanks again for all your input.

[KcDano]

The 5500c already has bearings.

[68KingFisher]

I ment to say upgrade to the newer ceramic bearings...sorry.....i'll probably go with the newer gear upgrades oldschoolbasser mentioned also. I've used the 5500-C3 several times recently and for the most part I like the reel.....My biggest negative is that the anti-reverse seems pretty excessive.....rolls backwards a quarter of a turn or so before it kicks in......I wonder if the upgraded gears will help that?

[oldschoolbasser]

It could be that your anti-reverse bushing is worn,and needs replacing.I would replace the part and see if it helps with your problem.

[thedude]

don't be afraid of BPS baitcasters.. i have 10 bps extremes of varying age and most still work like they were brand new. My oldest has about 6 years of service and works as good as the day i bought with very little maintenence. You can pick these things up used for 25$ (they are green BPS extreme reels). Decent bearings and brakes on them and extremely cost effective. Check the classifieds on bassboatcentral, they pop up there quite a bit. They are basically pflueger trions i think.

[BobP]

A couple of more personal, biased, opinions:

Judge every reel on its merits but I was burned, quality-wise, on several BassPro baitcasters when I took up fishing again 12 yrs ago. They contract with "who knows?" to make their reels. Maybe it's made by Pfleuger or Daiwa, maybe some by an unbranded Korean factory. They won't say and frankly, I don't care. A baitcaster spools up to 20,000 rpm on a cast. If everyting is not right internally, you are gonna have a bad day on the lake. I have a bunch of Shimano and Ambassadeur baitcasters, a few of which are 40 yrs old. When needed, I have no doubt whatsoever the parts will be available or I can send any of the reels to the factory or any of a hundred reel repair services to get them fixed 'good as new'. Try THAT with a BassPro! The only place you can send them is BassPro, and then pray they can get a part from the Far East.

Bearings: Better quality manufacturers put ABEC 3 to ABEC 5 bearings in their reels. You can buy higher quality ABEC 7 bearings for $8-10 from various sources; less than an original replacement bearing from the manufacturer. They last indefinitely with proper care and lubrication. Ceramics - Yes they are marginally faster than ABEC 7's and will cast marginally longer. They also cost twice as much, so IMO are suited more to guys "hot rodding" reels than "Average Joe Fisherman".

If you're having problems with a reel, check to see if it has been properly cleaned and lubed before you give it the Evil Eye. Baitcasters need comprehensive yearly service and lubrication of a few key parts more often to work well. I've bought quite a few used reels on Ebay. It's rare to get one that isn't gummed up and filthy, and doesn't need a 100% takedown, lube and reassembly. Guys don't maintain their reels, then whine when they stop working. Maybe it's just part of the modern "Everyting is Disposable" Mind Set. I'm not complaining! I've bought some great reels for not much because of it