squigster Posted March 23, 2009 Report Share Posted March 23, 2009 Hello I purchased a do it darter head jig mold in 1/16 and 1/8 sizes. I am using Eagle Claw L570 in 2/0 and 3/0. I am having a problem with the molds filling all the way.I preheated the mold on a hotplate with the hooks in it and the 1/8 oz pour ok but the 1/16 are next to impossible. I can't figure out what is going wrong. I am using a lee melting pot. The mold has a willowleaf shaped pour hole so maybe that has something to do with it. Any suggestions would be appreciated. Also does anyone know where you can buy quality lead? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cadman Posted March 23, 2009 Report Share Posted March 23, 2009 First of all you should always pour blank pours, to make sure the lead is filling the cavity. If you are not getting complete pours, several things. Mold is not hot enough or lead is not hot enough. Also sometimes on the really small jigs, the mold has to be hot, and I mean hot. You mentioned a Lee melting pot. Are you referring to a bottom pour pot. If you have the Lee IV bottom pour pot take the mold and put the sprue hole into the bottom of the pouring hole from the pot. This acts as a type of injection molding process. This does work very well for small jigs providing all of the above criteria are met. Finally you can try tilting your mold left, right, nose down and nose up. This will sometimes solve your problem. Once you find out what it is write it down on the mold by the cavity, or on a piece of paper, so you don't have to go through the trial and error again. I'm sure you will get some more tips, that I probably forgot. As far as lead goes, I get mine rom the junk yard, dentist office, or if you know a plumber ........All lead is pourable. Some softer lead works better for certain things. But I use a 60/40 or 70/30 mix 95% of the time. 70% hard 30% soft......Hope this helps some Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squigster Posted March 24, 2009 Author Report Share Posted March 24, 2009 Thanks Cadman, I let them sit on the hotplate for about 30 minutes before I poured the second batch. I could not touch the mold or it would burn me it was so hot. My stream was getting weaker as the amount of lead was used up so the injection pressure was not there and I was not putting it right in the hole. The problem with my lead is that it leaves alot of junk floating (impurities) and the lead was pouring with blues and green colors in it. I dont know what it is but I am assuming it has something to do with all the junk in the lead. Sometimes the pour pin sticks open and I cant get it closed easy unless I push a paper clip up the hole. I need better lead and I need to clean the pot. I will try again tomorrow night. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodkaman Posted March 24, 2009 Report Share Posted March 24, 2009 With all that crud on the top, it sounds like you are not doing the fluxing thing. Have you read the sticky at the top of the wire baits forum? This may solve all your problems, including the sticking pin. Read Sagacious's posts in the sticky. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basseducer Posted March 24, 2009 Report Share Posted March 24, 2009 squigster, I had both those molds and had the same problem even with the larger sizes. Everything cadman said is spot on, but you might also try smoking the cavities (I know he doesn't like it:p) I have noticed a difference. On that IV, you can rotate the pin with a screwdriver and usually clean out anything that has collected around the pin. If you decide to clean out your pot, after you have all the lead out take a wire bore brush and give the inside of the pour spout a good brushing, then take some steel wool to the pin. Then start out with the cleanest, purest, softest lead you can get. I found that the lead was the biggest factor in getting my molds to pour right. Hope this helps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cadman Posted March 24, 2009 Report Share Posted March 24, 2009 squigster,I had both those molds and had the same problem even with the larger sizes. Everything cadman said is spot on, but you might also try smoking the cavities (I know he doesn't like it:p) I have noticed a difference. On that IV, you can rotate the pin with a screwdriver and usually clean out anything that has collected around the pin. If you decide to clean out your pot, after you have all the lead out take a wire bore brush and give the inside of the pour spout a good brushing, then take some steel wool to the pin. Then start out with the cleanest, purest, softest lead you can get. I found that the lead was the biggest factor in getting my molds to pour right. Hope this helps. "(I know he doesn't like it:p)" Come on I'm open to suggestions, just not that one. I'm not that stubborn, or maybe I am Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ogajiga Posted March 24, 2009 Report Share Posted March 24, 2009 Ditto "the cleanest, purest, softest lead you can get". The only way my 1/16 & under molds will pour, & even some 1/8s. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squigster Posted March 24, 2009 Author Report Share Posted March 24, 2009 Thanks for the suggestions guys. I really appreciate it. Vodkaman I will read the sticky. Where do I get pure soft lead? I have been using left over plumber lead. Obviously it is not the greatest. I used to scoop of the crud with a spoon but I have the pot elevated and right under a ventilation hood. So I cant really see whats in there until its melted. My brother suggested lead shot for reloading shells but said it may be expensive and he was not sure of the quality either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodkaman Posted March 24, 2009 Report Share Posted March 24, 2009 As far as I am aware, plumbers lead and roofing lead are pure. Try the drop test, post No3 of the following link, by Hawnjigs: http://www.tackleunderground.com/forum/wire-baits/16388-scrap-yard-lead.html Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2fishon Posted March 24, 2009 Report Share Posted March 24, 2009 I use printers lead it is a hard lead so I all so mix in a little soft lead. You can buy the soft lead from bass pro if you have one near you, or you can order it on line. You can check with some local printers for the printers lead. If they have been in business a long time they may still have some laying around. The # 1 thing I would try is smoking the mold. Also I would cut a small line from the mold cavity to the edge of the mold to give it a little ventilation this worked well for me. I use a drimal tool to do this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ogajiga Posted March 25, 2009 Report Share Posted March 25, 2009 "Squigster", at least part of your fill out problem might be dirty lead. The sticky on fluxing should help you understand the process of cleaning contaminants from the melt. Not sure how much equipment expense you want to incur, but it really helps to have a separate pot, ladle, ingot mold, & burner setup for making clean lead ingots for your melter. I think having clean soft lead should be the first step in solving your problem. Altho fluxing can be done in a bottom pour pot, really dirty lead will create an excessive amount of dross to deal with, some of which will settle to the bottom of the pot and may cause issues at the pouring gate. If your problem is caused by mold issues, practically every fix possible as well as "2fishon"s vent line cutting, is available onboard in the archives. The most recent: http://www.tackleunderground.com/forum/wire-baits/16582-my-1-2-oz-poison-tail-driving-me-crazy.html Try what you can & if you've still got a problem, "sagacious" will show up and take solution to the next level ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodkaman Posted March 25, 2009 Report Share Posted March 25, 2009 Cutting the mold should be the very last option, I'm sure everyone would agree on that. Unless half a dozen write in and say that they have the same mold and it was the only way. When you solve it, post the solution. This kind of question comes up quite often. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squigster Posted March 25, 2009 Author Report Share Posted March 25, 2009 (edited) Ok I read the post you linked Vodkaman. It makes sense how to check the lead. What do they mean by fluxing and cleaning it up? I am assuming this is a method. Sorry I just read the sticky. I think I understand it now. I pour inside so Marvellux may be the best option to avoid smoke and flames. I dont want that. I pour alot of plastic and get enough grief from the boss lady over the smell coming from the garage. Dont wanna smoke up the house. I have a vented hood above the pot but it still dont catch everything. I think I will first look for better lead and try the fluxing along with smoking my mold. Thanks for all the help. If someone has a better idea please let me know. Thanks again! Edited March 25, 2009 by squigster Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodkaman Posted March 25, 2009 Report Share Posted March 25, 2009 This link contains everything you want to know about fluxing. http://www.tackleunderground.com/forum/wire-baits/13893-best-lead-melt-flux.html Post No7 gives a description of how to do it. You should read all 71 posts of the thread, then you will understand everything there is to know. Pay particular attention to Sagacious' posts. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squigster Posted March 26, 2009 Author Report Share Posted March 26, 2009 Ok for the next question. I want ot use Mustad Black Nickle hooks and I called a supplier that I wont name and was told the equivalent to an Eagle Claw 570 was a Mustad 32746BLN. I ordered the hooks and the shank from the bend to the eye is too long and dont fit in the Darter mold. Does anyone know if Mustad makes an equivalent to the Eagle Claw 570 in Black Nickel? Any help would be appreciated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ogajiga Posted March 26, 2009 Report Share Posted March 26, 2009 "Squigster" in my experience 32746 is an upgrade interchange for 570 - are you trying to fit 3/0 in the 1/16 ? That would be one size over and you might need to downsize to the specified 2/0. If the 2/0 doesn't fit the 1/16 that means your batch of hooks has a defective overlong "leg" between shank and eye, which would be very unusual for Mustad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squigster Posted March 26, 2009 Author Report Share Posted March 26, 2009 they must be the wrong hooks. I only bought the 3/0 Mustads and tried putting them in the 1/8 oz cavities which call for 3/0. I will call the store where I bought them at and see what they have to say Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ogajiga Posted March 26, 2009 Report Share Posted March 26, 2009 That is strange, If you still have some EC 3/0 you can compare the hooks together to see if the dimensions match up. Either your Mustads are long leg 3/0 or wrong size 4/0 would be my guess. If the 3/0 are a defective batch maybe 2/0 would fit the 1/8? If you absolutely need the larger 3/0 and "normal" 3/0 Mustads aren't available, Sickle BLC might be an option to consider. IMO the standard grade Mustad 32756 is not a quality option like 32746. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fish4tesq Posted March 26, 2009 Report Share Posted March 26, 2009 HELP.. Im wanting to pour my own bank sinkers probably 3,4 &5 oz. Can someone tell me what would be the best lead melter to get... Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSC Posted March 26, 2009 Report Share Posted March 26, 2009 HELP.. Im wanting to pour my own bank sinkers probably 3,4 &5 oz. Can someone tell me what would be the best lead melter to get... Thanks If it was me ... I would use a pot and ladel for sinkers of this size and larger. My JSC Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ogajiga Posted March 27, 2009 Report Share Posted March 27, 2009 Ditto JSC - for sinkers over 1 oz. pot, ladle, & cheapest possible scrap lead - wheel weights, shooting range lead, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sagacious Posted March 28, 2009 Report Share Posted March 28, 2009 Squigster, There's not really enough info in your intial posts about your pouring methods and setup to diagnose the fill-out problem you're having with the smaller cavity. More info will secure a more accurate solution-- otherwise you'll get many helpful suggestions but that can sometimes overwhelm the pourer with advice and actually make it harder to figure-out your specific difficulty. One thing I can probably eliminate from the list of potential problems is the oval-shaped pouring gate. That's not the source of your problem. If I were to guess, I think the problem likely stems from an inadequately hot mold or hooks (I know you said the mold is hot, but still...), inadequate venting, or improper pouring technique. Without more info it's all guesswork. There are any number of ways to go wrong when pouring lead-- if you can tell us more about what part of the cavity isn't filling, what the pours look like, etc, someone might be able to better narrow-it-down. As Hawnjigs pointed out, melting-down scrap in a bottom-pour inevitably causes frustration and clogged spouts later on. It also makes frequent fluxing considerably more necessary, and considerably more difficult. And as Cadman noted, pre-heating a mold on a hotplate is good, but you need to pour 'blank' pours without hooks until the castings are perfect and then add your warmed-up hooks to the cavity and begin pouring jigs. Heating the mold on a hotplate for 30 minutes before pouring a second batch indicates to me that there may be some fundamental problems in your technique. > Preheating by pouring blanks will answer the question of adequate preheating. > Downsizing to a 2/0 hook should answer the question of adequate venting. > Fluxing properly and pouring with a full pot of clean lead should help answer the question about proper pouring technique. Smoke the cavities to help 'break-in' the mold-- it's easy and costs nothing. Before you blame the mold or lead or search further-afield for more answers, make sure you're doing your part correctly. Try the suggestions posted above, preheat the mold by pouring blanks, read-up on fluxing, and let us know what happens. Best of luck! sagacious Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
