ninrugger Posted March 23, 2009 Report Share Posted March 23, 2009 hi guys, i'm pretty new to this but i've experimented with making POP molds and just recently made a resin mold. i was just using store bought baits and using them as masters and it worked out alright, but i'd like to make my own master. i have a couple questions that i haven't found answers to yet....been searching for a couple days and have found plenty of other useful info this site has so much info in it it makes my head spin. i'd like to do these molds with resin and i'm debating on which material to use for a master....clay or wax. 1) can a glossy finish be achieved if the clay isn't baked and sealed? 2) how thin can a wax master be without it melting down and loosing shape? i'm sure there are other questions i've thought of but can't remember at this moment....so i guess any info or advice would be great on using either of these two matierals with resin. thanks for the help guys Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nova Posted March 24, 2009 Report Share Posted March 24, 2009 hi guys, i'm pretty new to this but i've experimented with making POP molds and just recently made a resin mold. i was just using store bought baits and using them as masters and it worked out alright, but i'd like to make my own master. i have a couple questions that i haven't found answers to yet....been searching for a couple days and have found plenty of other useful info this site has so much info in it it makes my head spin. i'd like to do these molds with resin and i'm debating on which material to use for a master....clay or wax. 1) can a glossy finish be achieved if the clay isn't baked and sealed? 2) how thin can a wax master be without it melting down and loosing shape? i'm sure there are other questions i've thought of but can't remember at this moment....so i guess any info or advice would be great on using either of these two matierals with resin. thanks for the help guys Firstly; welcome to the addiction. lol I tried wax as a master and didn't like working with it but you might.(each of us have our own way of doing things) I use clay or I carve out from pine. Sometimes I even use a combination of both. I don't bake my clay; that way I can re-use it. The glossy finish come from the proper sealing of the mold. I have used resin for molds in the past but I found that if you are pouring a lot of baits at a time the resin heats up and will transfer the smell to the baits. Also, the mold has a tendancy to sag if it gets too hot. I make all my molds from POP. Hope this helps. www.novalures.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodkaman Posted March 24, 2009 Report Share Posted March 24, 2009 (edited) I read a web article the other day on how sensitive the sense of small is for fish, so Nova is making a valid point. Pam oil spray over the clay master should solve the smooth issues, but really it is all about the mold sealing operation, to get the glassy finish. be it elmers or epoxy. Dave Edited March 24, 2009 by Vodkaman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ninrugger Posted March 24, 2009 Author Report Share Posted March 24, 2009 thanks for the responses guys, i appreciate it! i've heard of smell being an issue, but i've also heard of guys dipping baits in gas (to prove a point) and still catching fish on them. so i think it depends more on the specific type of fish, whether they are more visual feeders vs smell feeders, and what kind of mood they are in. a fish with a more negative mood may need everything to be right with the bait before it sucks it in, scent included.... i'm not too worried about the warping or smell transfer issue because i'm not going to be mass producing these things.....yet lol.....i would prefer to use the resin simply because there is much less prep work before pouring. would spraying the 'wet' clay with pam produce a glossy finish in resin? if not, i could make the master mold out of POP, seal it, then with the pours i make out of that i could make a master mass production mold out of the resin. any thoughts? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodkaman Posted March 25, 2009 Report Share Posted March 25, 2009 Yes, the pam would help when using resin. i would prefer to use the resin simply because there is much less prep work before pouring You are not the first person to say this, but I still do not believe it. The prep work for resin is the same as for PoP, both need two components to be measured. The mixing is roughly the same too, except you get your hands in the PoP and rinse under the tap. Should you get the tiniest amount of resin on your skin, you will be rubbing and scrubbing for ten minutes, trying to get rid of it. Clean up, I pour any excess PoP mix into a container, wash out all mixing cups etc under the tap, it takes seconds and you are done, same with any spillage, a damp cloth or sponge and NO SMELL. Clean up with resin is a bit different. The mixing cups go in the bin. Spillage! best let it cure and chip it off with a sharp knife, assuming a metal or tile surface. Then you have the fumes to contend with (from both the resin and the wife). I use both PoP and resin for my projects, each has its pro's and con's, so I am not biased either way. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nova Posted March 25, 2009 Report Share Posted March 25, 2009 The quality of the finished mold (resin) is directly related to the quality of the master. Sraying it will not produce a better finish; in fact it may even make the finished product worse. www.novalures.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zbass Posted March 25, 2009 Report Share Posted March 25, 2009 ninrigger, I have used wax for making masters and resin for my molds http://i614.photobucket.com/albums/tt226/zbasser/baits/creatures/35ZGRUB.jpg That is a bait that was wax master and resin mold. No spraying involoved of Pam or otherwise. Wax will melt off almost completely when the resin cures. Your mater will be gone, but you already have a mold of it. As far as using clay for a master in a resin mold, I have not done that. I might suggest not spraying directly on the master a you may get more of a mess then you want. Try brushing it on with a soft hobby brush. It should give you a glossy finish as long as it doesn't soak in the clay. The smell factor is one that I don't understand. I have not had a smell transfer that I can detect from a cured mold. resin Gets hard quickly, and you can pour in it. It takes a day or 23 before it is fully cured. After that you should not have a smell problem. I have not found that talking fish yet that can tell me if he can smell rein in my baits or not. But have caught plenty of fish on my baits. Hope that helps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ninrugger Posted March 25, 2009 Author Report Share Posted March 25, 2009 (edited) zbass, that grub looks real nice, it looks like wax might be a good option. nova, are you saying that i shouldn't spray a clay master with pam before i pour the resin? i'd like to get this done right the first time and not have to deal with too many mistakes and re-do's....especially if 50 other people have already made the same mistakes......otherwise i'd have to go by the handle "US Government" instead of "ninrugger" vodkaman, thanks for the info, i guess i'm looking at prep time in terms of how long it takes me to make the mold until i can start pouring baits. a resin mold i can pour into in a few hours usually.....the POP molds i've made have taken a week to seal properly before pouring. but i was using a polyeurathane sealer in a can. i haven't tried the elmers technique yet. what kind of elmers would i use for that?? Edited March 25, 2009 by ninrugger Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nova Posted March 26, 2009 Report Share Posted March 26, 2009 I wouldn't do anything to the clay master. I think the clay would cause the spray to bead up that would make your mold have imperfections in it. If your clay master is unbaked you will have no trouble getting it out of the resin after the mold sets up no matter what the shape of the master. www.novalures.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pitbull Baits Posted March 26, 2009 Report Share Posted March 26, 2009 Zbass has got the mold thing down he saved my rear the other day. He knows what he is talking about! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zbass Posted March 26, 2009 Report Share Posted March 26, 2009 Thanks PitBull. Nova and vodkaman have taught me a thing or two also. They have good advise as well. It is just that each of us has something that works for us. That is the beauty of this site and others that you can share info and find out what works for you. Thanks again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
