Jig Man Posted December 31, 2009 Report Share Posted December 31, 2009 I have some hand injectors that I have been using for some custom baits. I have been using JB weld to hold everything in place but in less than 200 baits I have gone through 2 injectors. What is tougher or more heat resistant? The first pic is an injector with less than 100 baits. The second is not used yet. The first one melted all the J B and slid up inside the tube. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nova Posted December 31, 2009 Report Share Posted December 31, 2009 Question:- what are the tubes at the top made of? Do you rough sand the area of the injector with large grit sandpaper before you apply the JB? As far as something more heat resistant goes; you should talk to someone in the automotive repair department of your local dealership. www.novalures.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluegrasslover Posted December 31, 2009 Report Share Posted December 31, 2009 I have some hand injectors that I have been using for some custom baits. I have been using JB weld to hold everything in place but in less than 200 baits I have gone through 2 injectors. What is tougher or more heat resistant? The first pic is an injector with less than 100 baits. The second is not used yet. The first one melted all the J B and slid up inside the tube. JB Weld is some tough stuff and I would think it would hold up to the heat but I can't imagine it adhering to the plastic. It's just a type of epoxy and usually epoxy and plastic don't work well together. J-B Weld will not adhere to, or bond well to: Any flexible rubber surface Leather Vinyl Canvass Polypropylene plastic Polyethylene plastic Loctite has an epoxy that is supposed to adhere to plastic but I'm not sure about the temp rating. Greg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluegrasslover Posted December 31, 2009 Report Share Posted December 31, 2009 I have some hand injectors that I have been using for some custom baits. I have been using JB weld to hold everything in place but in less than 200 baits I have gone through 2 injectors. What is tougher or more heat resistant? The first pic is an injector with less than 100 baits. The second is not used yet. The first one melted all the J B and slid up inside the tube. JB Weld is some tough stuff and I would think it would hold up to the heat but I can't imagine it adhering to the plastic. It's just a type of epoxy and usually epoxy and plastic don't work well together. J-B Weld will not adhere to, or bond well to: Any flexible rubber surface Leather Vinyl Canvass Polypropylene plastic Polyethylene plastic Loctite has an epoxy that is supposed to adhere to plastic but I'm not sure about the temp rating. Greg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jig Man Posted December 31, 2009 Author Report Share Posted December 31, 2009 The metal tubes at the top are brass with brass compression fittings on them. Do you think bondo fiberglass resin with fiberglass cloth would do the trick? These are catheter syringes that can only be obtained now with a perscription and I only have a few left. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piscivorous Pike Posted December 31, 2009 Report Share Posted December 31, 2009 Sounds like you are doing what I did and are going to spend more money tinkering than settling on good injectors in the first place. I made injectors from bicycle tire pumps, plumping supplies and an automotive oil hand pump and also fiddled a wee bit with food injectors and then the good ones. Post #5 shows my plumbing injector in this thread: Plastic Injector If you want inexpensive syringe type injectors consider the metal canjun style injectors, here, this page has several brands in 6 and 9 inch injectors: http://www.grillingaccessories.com/category_name_Injectors_path_2120-2146.html The page is for image reference, I have no idea about them as a vendor. I found food injectors at Sportsmans Warehouse and other places that work with smokers. But the best I used was injectors made by Bear Baits.com and Delmart.com for making baits. I had injectors from each. Both have unique features and are excellent. Neither is very expensive. I did not have good success with my molds and it was because of their construction, nothing wrong with the injectors, so I went to a vacume induction method that uses negative pressure so that atmospheric pressure injects the plastic in my DIY POP and DWP molds. I believe the food injectors produce a much more narrow stream and have a needle that can be cut to make a tube like your injectors. I hope you found my follies useful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jig Man Posted January 1, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 1, 2010 Do you really think the food injectors would work for plastic? I have looked at the injectors on the market and I don't think that they will do what I need as I am injecting into individual tube molds that are 5/8" diameterX3" length. These are what I am making. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piscivorous Pike Posted January 1, 2010 Report Share Posted January 1, 2010 Do you really think the food injectors would work for plastic? I have looked at the injectors on the market and I don't think that they will do what I need as I am injecting into individual tube molds that are 5/8" diameterX3" length. These are what I am making. Yes, the metal ones will. At least for a while. MTfishingrods, Shane, has used them too. Maybe he can comment. I think they eventually wear out, warp, because of the heat. But they work better than plastic ones. You are spending a dollar to save a penny. Treat yourself and get one of the good ones. And I presume you are injecting two piece molds, not using a fine stream to fill an open mold process. If you are using the syringes to fill small apendages on open molds, well, someone else better comment on that because I have no experience with that technique. I would think the full injectors have too big a nozzle for that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jig Man Posted January 1, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 1, 2010 I am using 5/8" diameter brass tubes 3" long with inserts in the bottom to make the baits. Each bait has to be injected. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piscivorous Pike Posted January 1, 2010 Report Share Posted January 1, 2010 I am using 5/8" diameter brass tubes 3" long with inserts in the bottom to make the baits. Each bait has to be injected. very interesting, unique and obviously you are a fellow that is not inhibited or afraid to tackle a project like that. I think both Del's and Bear's injector nozzles would need modification as they are straight tubes about the same diameter as yours. I think you could easily adapt them to take your "tube" molds either to slip in or screw in. I would get the smallest injector they offer to do your thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jig Man Posted January 1, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 1, 2010 So far the only way I can get this to work is to run plastic into each tube tnen stick it down to the compression fitting and put pressure on it to make the tail. I have never seen one of the bear's injectors but they seem to sell for a lot of money and mine have been costing less than $1.00 @. I have a smaller version that uses 35mm injectors and lasts for 500+ baits. It is the larger ones with more plastic are making a short lived injector. Which is costing me a $0.05 or so more and some work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piscivorous Pike Posted January 1, 2010 Report Share Posted January 1, 2010 So far the only way I can get this to work is to run plastic into each tube tnen stick it down to the compression fitting and put pressure on it to make the tail. I have never seen one of the bear's injectors but they seem to sell for a lot of money and mine have been costing less than $1.00 @. I have a smaller version that uses 35mm injectors and lasts for 500+ baits. It is the larger ones with more plastic are making a short lived injector. Which is costing me a $0.05 or so more and some work. Oh, for $1 and if you only make a few for yourself, then economically stick with it. I said when I sold my injectors the cost and loss was justified only as an expense to have fun with my hobby. It is like eating a sandwhich or going out to dinner. Both feed you, but one is more fun. The fun is proportianal to the money spent, like always. That is something you will have to decide. Nevertheless, I am impressed and you really are creative. Thanks for the conversation, Happy New Year! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimcline Posted January 2, 2010 Report Share Posted January 2, 2010 So far the only way I can get this to work is to run plastic into each tube tnen stick it down to the compression fitting and put pressure on it to make the tail. I have never seen one of the bear's injectors but they seem to sell for a lot of money and mine have been costing less than $1.00 @. I have a smaller version that uses 35mm injectors and lasts for 500+ baits. It is the larger ones with more plastic are making a short lived injector. Which is costing me a $0.05 or so more and some work. Jig Man, a couple of suggestions. First, if you're not dead set on staying with this method, why not try to make dipping rods out of those same tubes and do horizintal dipping? It's easy to learn and the color combination ar endless. Second, I see your point about saving money, but in the long run are you saving? Bear's injectors run about 50.00 for a small injector and they'll last forever. You may have to change o-ring every now and then but that's it. If you want to stay with your rig, I see a way to use one of his injectors, or Del's too. I haven't used Del's but I'm sure they would work also. With Bear's, you could use a 1/2 in brass close nipple or reducer and reduce it to the size injection nozzle you need. The 1/2 inch close nipple has a 5/8 id and will take one of Bear's nozzle perfectly. Then it's just a matter of inserting your nozzle into into the tube jig you're using and then fitting the injection nozzle into the close nipple and you're good to go. Just make sure you've got a solid "connection" so to speak so you don't spray hot plastic all over the place. Iknow the close nipples work well because I've been making injection plates for my one piece molds from both Del's and Bob's and they're a perfect fit. And the molds shoot lights out by the way without even having to cut vents. I hope any of this helps, JIM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nova Posted January 2, 2010 Report Share Posted January 2, 2010 I like to tinker as much as the next guy; but I think that in the end you will spend more money than it would cost to buy the proper injector. I have run into this before when I first started this insanity; lol. If money doesn't matter then fill your boots and keep us informed on how you make out. Sometimes it can trigger some interesting comments and thoughts from other members. www.novalures.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jig Man Posted January 2, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 2, 2010 Jig Man, a couple of suggestions. First, if you're not dead set on staying with this method, why not try to make dipping rods out of those same tubes and do horizintal dipping? You will have to give me some instruction here if you don't mind. I have plugs which go into the tubes and represent the inverse of the gurb tail. How can I do a horizontal dip and keep the tube filled with plastic as I take it out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimcline Posted January 2, 2010 Report Share Posted January 2, 2010 You will have to give me some instruction here if you don't mind. I have plugs which go into the tubes and represent the inverse of the gurb tail. How can I do a horizontal dip and keep the tube filled with plastic as I take it out. Okay, first I would advise you to do a search on tube dipping on here and anything posted on the subject by a member called Bojon. The guy is the absolute best at horizontal tube dipping. Okay that said, let's work on your problem. To do horizontal dipping you will need to change your basic set-up. If I understand correctly, you are filling the inside of your tubes and then basically just pulling the plastic out after it sets. For normal dipping the plastic will be on the outside of the rods so you'll be pulling the finished tubes off the outside of the rod. Remember, use a little Pam or some kind of cooking spray to lube the rods. You will need to plug one end of your rods with jb weld or something similar. It will be much easier if you put a small wad of tissue paper in first so you don't waste any of your material. Then you'll need to jb weld some "handles" in the other ends. You can use pieces of wire coat hangers for this. Bend a short L in one end of your pieces of wire and then jb that short end into the end of your dipping rods. I'd try to glue at least an inch or so deep if you can. Or you can you use solid aluminum rod for your dipping rods. I like the 3/8 size. That's what I use and I tend to like them better than the the hollow rods. You can use a grinder to round off the head end to make a better looking tube. You can get the aluminum rod at Lowe's or Home Depot, etc. After the JB sets, you're ready to dip tubes. But like I said research Bojon's posts and you'll get a real eye opener. He actually has a dvd on how to do it. And Ron is always willing to answer questions you may have. I hope any of this helps. If you have any more questions, don't hesitate to ask, JIM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piscivorous Pike Posted January 2, 2010 Report Share Posted January 2, 2010 I follow you , Jim, maybe this is something new for me to try! I used to fish a log of bass sized tubes but over time have switched to jerk baits and flukes. I have been interested in maybe dipping hollow swim baits, the ones that look like a table knive and spinner blade are soldered together. I have seen the injection molds that have inserts to form tails in tubes. Is there a tool that is used to shred the end of the dip tube that maybe resembles a comb of razor blades? I can see where a dipped tube can give you a huge variety of tail choices. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimcline Posted January 2, 2010 Report Share Posted January 2, 2010 I follow you , Jim, maybe this is something new for me to try! I used to fish a log of bass sized tubes but over time have switched to jerk baits and flukes. I have been interested in maybe dipping hollow swim baits, the ones that look like a table knive and spinner blade are soldered together. I have seen the injection molds that have inserts to form tails in tubes. Is there a tool that is used to shred the end of the dip tube that maybe resembles a comb of razor blades? I can see where a dipped tube can give you a huge variety of tail choices. PP, yes there are several types of tail cutters out there. The best one is the one that Bojon was making. I'm not sure he still is. I got one from him and it really works. Picture a bunch of small pizza cutter blades fitted together on a rod with the ends of a mini rolling pin for handles. There is also the mallet type which involves a bunch of stanley blades fitted into holder and then you use a mallet of some sort to tap the top of it to cut the tails of your tubes. The rotary type that Bojon makes is far superior though, and much easier. Again, I'm sure he will be glad to help you with the plans to make one yourself. It's well worth pursuing. Tubes may just be the fish catchingest bait on the planet. But I am kind of biased . JIM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jig Man Posted January 2, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 2, 2010 I guess there is some kind of miscommunication here. I am not making tubes. I am making pointed tailed grubs. I use a completely different process to make tubes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimcline Posted January 2, 2010 Report Share Posted January 2, 2010 I guess there is some kind of miscommunication here. I am not making tubes. I am making pointed tailed grubs. I use a completely different process to make tubes. My mistake Jig Man. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
