New Swimbait Non Foiled Edition

[nitro98]

Got this one done last night. Looking for some painting advice though

[nitro98]

I painted the lure with createx and the top coat used was D2T. However after using the lure for about and hour i noticed that the paint appeared to be bubbling under the top coat. Not dramatically but i noticed it. Do you guys think i need to have a sealing coat before a base coat is laid down? Or would using an acrylic paint be any better than the water based createx? Heck it could be a rushed top coat missed a spot. Any advice would be appreciated.

[mark poulson]

Nice bait. I wish I could help you, but the only time I've had epoxy problems like that was when I got the mix proportions wrong, and it stayed tacky. I put another coat of properly mixed epoxy over it, and it was fine.

You didn't use isopropal alcohol instead of denatured, by any chance?

I know that can screw up epoxy.

I've used D2T over lots of lures I primed with rattle can primer, and painted with Createx, and never encountered the kind of paint bubbling you're describing.

[nitro98]

i used the D2T out of the smalll tube. I thought that squeezing it out gave the right mix propotions but maybe not? I also left the bait in the boat in the sun and noticed the D2T yellowed. Maybe it was a bad batch. Have you use etex? im thinking about buying some and trying it out. The D2T just isnt working for me.

[JP MYERS]

You need to weigh the portions or use a small measuring cup.. Squeezing out of the tube, almost always, one side sends out more than the other.. You have to reeeally give the tube plunger an even pressure to get equal amounts of both parts-- better off to weigh or measure.. You can also get D2T in squeeze bottles..

Yeah the D2T will yellow quickly from my experience w/it.. I switched over to E-Tex and have been nothing but pleased.. You'll need to rotate your lure w/e-tex for 3-4 hours then hang to dry for another 8 hrs or so.. It takes far longer to cure than Dev. but worth the wait.. Crystal clear & super glossy..

BTW, sounds like your coating didnt cure properly, as stated by Mark, it was probably improper mixing..Did you notice if any of the surface was tacky after it set in the sun?.. Thats a dead giveaway too..

I've been using Createx & never had any such problems, gots ta be da mix..I have had enamels wrinkle after appling devcon, but that was becuz the paint had not cured completely..

Hope it all works out for ya,

Jp~

[capt mike]

You need to weigh the portions or use a small measuring cup.. Squeezing out of the tube, almost always, one side sends out more than the other.. You have to reeeally give the tube plunger an even pressure to get equal amounts of both parts-- better off to weigh or measure.. You can also get D2T in squeeze bottles..

Yeah the D2T will yellow quickly from my experience w/it.. I switched over to E-Tex and have been nothing but pleased.. You'll need to rotate your lure w/e-tex for 3-4 hours then hang to dry for another 8 hrs or so.. It takes far longer to cure than Dev. but worth the wait.. Crystal clear & super glossy..

BTW, sounds like your coating didnt cure properly, as stated by Mark, it was probably improper mixing..Did you notice if any of the surface was tacky after it set in the sun?.. Thats a dead giveaway too..

I've been using Createx & never had any such problems, gots ta be da mix..I have had enamels wrinkle after appling devcon, but that was becuz the paint had not cured completely..

Hope it all works out for ya,

Jp~

What material is the lure made of? I'm having the same problem with one of my baits. I'm told that you have to heat cure the createx before topcoating. Did you heat yours?

That bait looks great. How did you hinge it?

[nitro98]

the bait is made of alumilite. i heat treated the paint as recommended by ctex. but one thing im still a little skeptical of is the ctex. the resin has tiny pores from the microballons and the hinges have recesses that can not be completely sealed with a top coat of clear. this theoretically would allow moisture to penetrate behind the paint and foul it up. any thoughts on this theory? anyone had the same problem?

[mark poulson]

Are your hinges openable, so you can disassemble the lure when you're coating it?

[nitro98]

I can pull the pins out and do each section but I like to do it as one piece. Is there any paint out there that doesn't have to be cleared?

[rofish]

Nitro 98,

In my opinion, your problem with the air bubbles showing under the clearcoat is due to the changing of temperature the swimbait is subject to. Air will expand at higher temperature, and will encounter weak resistance from the paint, if any, then it will be stopped in its way out by the epoxy clearcoat.

To prevent this from happening, I can think of 2 solutions:

1) Seal the lure with epoxy before painting it

2) Heat the lure and the epoxy when applying the clearcoat.

But I think that in both cases it is better to heat the lure and the epoxy when sealing or clearcoating it.

Don't know how much temperature the alumilite can withstand, but try to use heat for the lure before applying epoxy to it. I also use a hair drier to heat the epoxy after mixing it. And after clearcoating, before rotating the lure, I heat the lure again with the drier, and this operation will take out any air bubbles which might still exist in the epoxy.

[mark poulson]

I can pull the pins out and do each section but I like to do it as one piece. Is there any paint out there that doesn't have to be cleared?

When I used epoxy as a top coat, with the lure disassembeled, I would coat the insides of the joints first with D2T, and lap in onto the face 1/4", for good overlap with the face coating.

Then, after the D2T had hardened, I'd reassemble the lure, put it on the drying wheel, and coat it with Nu Lustre 55, making sure the epoxy lapped into the joints a little, but not enough to gum up the hinges.

I coated the faces of the lure twice, but the insides of the joints only once, because D2T goes on much thicker than Nu Lustre, or Etex, or any other decoupage-type epoxy.

I wore throw away latex gloves whenever I handled the lure, because epoxy doesn't like finger print oils.

[Jwags]

You need to weigh the portions or use a small measuring cup.. Squeezing out of the tube, almost always, one side sends out more than the other.. You have to reeeally give the tube plunger an even pressure to get equal amounts of both parts-- better off to weigh or measure.. You can also get D2T in squeeze bottles..

Jp~

I would stick with a measuring syringe instead of weighing epoxy. The two parts do not weight the same! That is why epoxy manufacturers measure by volume, not weight.

jeremy

[nitro98]

Nitro 98,

In my opinion, your problem with the air bubbles showing under the clearcoat is due to the changing of temperature the swimbait is subject to. Air will expand at higher temperature, and will encounter weak resistance from the paint, if any, then it will be stopped in its way out by the epoxy clearcoat.

To prevent this from happening, I can think of 2 solutions:

1) Seal the lure with epoxy before painting it

2) Heat the lure and the epoxy when applying the clearcoat.

But I think that in both cases it is better to heat the lure and the epoxy when sealing or clearcoating it.

Don't know how much temperature the alumilite can withstand, but try to use heat for the lure before applying epoxy to it. I also use a hair drier to heat the epoxy after mixing it. And after clearcoating, before rotating the lure, I heat the lure again with the drier, and this operation will take out any air bubbles which might still exist in the epoxy.

The alumilite can take a fair amount of heat. I have thought about sealing with clear before painting but the D2T is a pain at sharp edges and it always ends up retracting from the edges by a 1/16 of an inch. Also the microbubbles leave these very tiny holes on the surface of the lure..especially toward the back of the bait. The D2T also does not like to bridge these gaps. The paint will fill these little holes but the epoxy wont.

[nitro98]

maybe this will help

Document1.pdf

Document1.pdf

Document1.pdf

Document1.pdf

Document1.pdf

Document1.pdf

Document1.pdf

Document1.pdf

Document1.pdf

[mark poulson]

The alumilite can take a fair amount of heat. I have thought about sealing with clear before painting but the D2T is a pain at sharp edges and it always ends up retracting from the edges by a 1/16 of an inch. Also the microbubbles leave these very tiny holes on the surface of the lure..especially toward the back of the bait. The D2T also does not like to bridge these gaps. The paint will fill these little holes but the epoxy wont.

Rounding both the leading and the trailing edges of your bait sections slightly, and brushing the D2T into the joint faces first should take care of the retracting.

If you coat the faces on the same day, the epoxy bonds to itself fine.

If you wait longer than a day, sand the lap area with 400 grit, and wipe them down with DN alcohol.

A rattle can primer, several coats, should take care of the micro holes.

The PVC decking I use is a coarser material once the smooth facing has been removed.

I put on two coats of rattle can primer, wet sand it, and then add one more coat.

The primer I use, Rustoleum, says to recoat anytime within the first hour, or after 24 hours.

It also says you can wet sand after half an hour, and that's what I do.

Even if it's not perfectly smooth, the Createx fills in what's left nicely.

If I have a void too big for the paint to fill, I use bondo, or Zap a Gap glue, with their accelerator, and then just sand that down smooth before priming.

Edited June 29, 2010 by mark poulson

[gunnie3035]

maybe this will help

Your right, the 2-ton is not going to fill in the holes and the 2-ton bubbled because your paint wasn't completely dry or 2-ton wasn't fully curred when it got wet [maybe from improper mixing?]. You have some options, either use some sort of bondo filler and fill in the holes or switch clear coats and dip each section individually. I suppose you could always spray DN too. Etex will even be a bigger problem if the holes arent filled in. I love 2-ton, but on resin baits its DN all the way.

[rofish]

The alumilite can take a fair amount of heat. I have thought about sealing with clear before painting but the D2T is a pain at sharp edges and it always ends up retracting from the edges by a 1/16 of an inch. Also the microbubbles leave these very tiny holes on the surface of the lure..especially toward the back of the bait. The D2T also does not like to bridge these gaps. The paint will fill these little holes but the epoxy wont.

It all depends on what your goal is. I was trying to explain how you could get rid of the bubbles which you see under the clearcoat. D2T has a great advantage as a clearcoat, and that is the fact that it can level out the surface very well. So if you apply first a coat of epoxy, before you put any paint on the lure, you will have a perfectly smooth surface to paint on. And do not fear that epoxy will not bridge the gaps created by the microballoons, especially if you thin a little bit the epoxy before brushing it on, and on condition that you heat the lure before applying the epoxy. Even if the epoxy will not be able to reach the bottom of each individual tiny hole, which I doubt, the fact that the air which could be trapped in these holes is warm, meaning expanded in volume,will determine that once the temperature of the lure decreases, the volume of the air will also decrease. But the fact that you also hit the lure with heat right after brushing the epoxy on, will soften the epoxy, making it more fluid, and therefore enabling any air bubbles to escape from it. So the air bubbles are not linked to the paint or to an improper mixing of D2T. Once fully cured, you can lightly sand the surface of the epoxy, so the paint could better adhere on it. And you have there a perfect surface to paint on, without any fear that bubbles might show up.

The problem with the epoxy not liking to cover sharp edges is real and well known. Follow Mark Poulson's instructions and you will have no such problems in future.

[nitro98]

What would be the best way to apply the epoxy? With a brush? Dipping? While the lure ison the drying wheel?

[rofish]

What would be the best way to apply the epoxy? With a brush? Dipping? While the lure ison the drying wheel?

Nitro,

See if you can adapt this idea to your needs. I designed this lure holder to be used for brushing epoxy onto swimbaits, but I haven't tried it yet. I'm too lazy, I think. The wire is hard tempered steel wire, so it acts like a spring, pulling the lure from both ends, so the swimbait could stay in a straight position while brushing the epoxy on. You cannot dip a lure in epoxy, because it is to thick for this purpose, and you will also have to throw away a lot from the mixture. So you have to brush the epoxy on, just before you put the lure on the drying wheel.If your swimbait does not have a wire eye at the very end of the tail, as your picture shows, you could think of adding a small (short) wire eye, which you could eliminate after clearcoating.

But I'm not expert at all in making swimbaits, so I think you could ask Mark Poulson or others for some guidelines in this respect.

http://s84.photobucket.com/albums/k5/rofish_2006/rofish_2006-4/?action=view&current=wirelureholder003.jpg&newest=1

[nitro98]

Thanks for the info. I have been brushing it on as well. I primed a bait last night and am going to put a light sealing layer of etex on tonight. The primer did a great job of filling the tiny holes that the ctex and d2t wouldn't fill. Now the bait is nice a smooth. If all goes well I'll have a big batch made this weekend. I have about 10 baits that swim awesome but I haven't wanted to finish them b/c I was getting some crappy results as you can tell from my previous pictures