Need Help With Chigger Craw Mold

[ranger77]

I am new to pouring plastics and i am very frustrated at this point and would appreciate any help you guys could give me. I have made 4 rtv selicone molds of a 3" chigger craw. I made these two piece molds so that they would be round just like the ones in the stores. I have vent holes at the bottom of the mold so the air gets pushed out but my craws still will not fill up. I can hand pour about 1 good one to 10 bad ones. I even ordered a cheap injector from janns netcraft last week and they still do not fill up. I have put about 120 dollars into this and still hardley have any baits to show for it. Any help would greatly be appreciated.

[Vodkaman]

If I was making a mold of this bait, the pic shows how I would vent it (the two lines on the left represent the sprue).

Dave

Edited July 26, 2010 by Vodkaman

[ranger77]

If I was making a mold of this bait, the pic shows how I would vent it (the two lines on the left represent the sprue).

Dave

Thanks i will try that. Do you know where i can get a mold like that already made? I feel like if i get a good quality mold i will get a perfect pour almost every time. I might need to buy a lot better injector also.

[Vodkaman]

these lures had best be for your own use only, or you will find yourself in BIG trouble.

Introduce the vents one at a time, you may not need them all. Start off in the problem areas.

Dave

Edited July 26, 2010 by Vodkaman

[GB GONE]

Check Del-mart.com. He has a VERY similar mold. You may also be able to see Del's vent lines.

Jim

[Kozak]

these lures had best be for your own use only, or you will find yourself in BIG trouble.

Can you get in trouble for selling lures that are copies of ones already out there? Even if you give them a new name? I know my trickworm-style mold is exactly like that of Zoom's 6.25", but if you look, I believe NetBait also sells the exact same thing (slightly harder plastic with less salt)

[mark poulson]

Can you get in trouble for selling lures that are copies of ones already out there? Even if you give them a new name? I know my trickworm-style mold is exactly like that of Zoom's 6.25", but if you look, I believe NetBait also sells the exact same thing (slightly harder plastic with less salt)

I think, legally, if you copy someone's work exactly, and sell it, you could be sued.

Small guys can't afford the legal expenses involved, so be careful.

[Vodkaman]

It is all down to whether the lure design is patented. As for a worm, their is not much room for patents, a worm is a worm, unless it has specific features. If the lure is patented, it will likely quote patent numbers on the package and/or web site.

Names are a separate issue. You can get into trouble by using the same name or even a similar name, even if the bait is not patented.

Personally, I believe that if you are going to sell lures, then you should go to the trouble of developing your own lure, rather than copying someone elses work and calling it your own, even if the original was not protected. But we have been here before and I have heard all the arguements about customer demands etc. so I hope this doesn't develope into another heated discussion. I accept that this is not a moral industry, with the big players stealing from the small players. This fact will probably be justification enough for the small players to copy the big players.

I suggest do a little research before exposing yourself to risk of legal action. Do not make the mistake of thinking that you are too small for them to bother about. Their are plenty of posts here on TU, about the dreaded 'cease and desist' letter arriving to spoil your day.

Dave

[ranger77]

It is all down to whether the lure design is patented. As for a worm, their is not much room for patents, a worm is a worm, unless it has specific features. If the lure is patented, it will likely quote patent numbers on the package and/or web site.

Names are a separate issue. You can get into trouble by using the same name or even a similar name, even if the bait is not patented.

Personally, I believe that if you are going to sell lures, then you should go to the trouble of developing your own lure, rather than copying someone elses work and calling it your own, even if the original was not protected. But we have been here before and I have heard all the arguements about customer demands etc. so I hope this doesn't develope into another heated discussion. I accept that this is not a moral industry, with the big players stealing from the small players. This fact will probably be justification enough for the small players to copy the big players.

I suggest do a little research before exposing yourself to risk of legal action. Do not make the mistake of thinking that you are too small for them to bother about. Their are plenty of posts here on TU, about the dreaded 'cease and desist' letter arriving to spoil your day.

Dave

I had a close friend of mine tell me that he did some research on those patents because he had a worm he wanted to patent. Well he said that if it just says patent pending then there is nothing they can do about it if you copy it, but if has patent and then numbers on it or on the pack, then you better leave it alone. However, you have to take the name of the company off the bait because that is their registered trademark. I have made this mold were it no longer has the name on the bottom of the bait. Looks great now! I might be wrong about the patents so i havent sold any yet.

[Vodkaman]

I am not an expert by any means. But following discussions with a patent lawyer, once the patent has been registered or applied for (pending), this gives me freedom to manufacture and distribute my product under the protection of the patent. This first part of the patent procedure is the cheapest and gives me two years (I think) to test the market. If successful, I continue the process and throw more money at it. Eventually, the patent is granted and I get my number and certificate etc. Then I can challenge anyone who copied my work, even if my work was only patent pending at the time.

If I am wrong in this understanding, please correct me. Patent pending means that the design is off limits. If the designer chooses not to follow through with the full patent, then you are OK. Best not to invest too much in tooling if the bait is pending.

Dave

[ranger77]

I am not an expert by any means. But following discussions with a patent lawyer, once the patent has been registered or applied for (pending), this gives me freedom to manufacture and distribute my product under the protection of the patent. This first part of the patent procedure is the cheapest and gives me two years (I think) to test the market. If successful, I continue the process and throw more money at it. Eventually, the patent is granted and I get my number and certificate etc. Then I can challenge anyone who copied my work, even if my work was only patent pending at the time.

If I am wrong in this understanding, please correct me. Patent pending means that the design is off limits. If the designer chooses not to follow through with the full patent, then you are OK. Best not to invest too much in tooling if the bait is pending.

Dave

Well i guess i wont be selling them afterall. Thanks for the info thats why i joined this forum so you guys could help me out.

[GB GONE]

Chigger craw is currently part of the suit brought by NetBait. NetBait claims that the Chigger craw (and roughly 16 other baits) infringe upon NetBaits patent.

If you read the patents well (I still do not understand all I read most of the time), it is rarely the whole bait that has been patented. Mostly it is a portion of the bait. Easiest one to mention is the end of the Zoom Ultravibe speed craw, Horny toad legs and ultravibe speed worm. The end area is the only potion patented.

Also, many baits have the particular action they impart patented as well. Many overlook this side of the patent and can get in hot water quick.

Copyright infringement with names etc is another whole big deal.

You will get as cease and desist letter prior to most actions being taken against you or your company in either case.

Jim

Edited July 29, 2010 by ghostbaits

[earthworm77]

I believe its trademark infringement.

[GB GONE]

Oops... Your right Craig!!!!! Trademarking is for the names such as "Trickworm".

I was told to copyright my rigging instructions on my baits to help others from expalining how to use the baits in writing. I could not afford to patent or defend a patent on the bait itself.

Good advise from a patent professional.

Jim