COBRA Posted October 10, 2010 Report Share Posted October 10, 2010 Now I am really confused. I never agreed with the whole Larew patent on having salt in your product. That is way behind us anyways. I never could accept the whole idea of a patent keeping someone from pouring a certain ingredient into their product. Anyways, just a side thought, I thought that Strike King had a the same type of patent on their coffee formula? Yet lure craft sells coffee scent, and I have plenty of coffee scent of my own, which I never used. Just a confusing thought that ran across my mind this morning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodkaman Posted October 10, 2010 Report Share Posted October 10, 2010 You should post some patent numbers, so we can all have a read. Don't make us search. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodkaman Posted October 12, 2010 Report Share Posted October 12, 2010 Here is a link to the Larew patent: http://www.freepatentsonline.com/4530179.html As Cobra indicated, the patent is expired, having been filed in 1981 and out lived its 20 year lifespan. Ironically, the patent protects salt as used as a flavouring, not as a means of increasing the density of the plastic. This a link for the coffee patent: http://www.freepatentsonline.com/y2008/0263933.html It was filed on 30th April 2007 and as far as I can tell, is still active. I was particularly amused by claim No5: 5. The fishing lure of claim 4 wherein the improvement further comprises said particulate coffee material having an average particulate size in the range of from about 350 to about 10,000 microns. A micron is one millionth of a meter, 10,000 microns is 1 centimeter, 0.39", that is a very big coffee particle. Sorry about my earlier post Cobra, didn't mean it to come across so strong. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
biggun Posted October 12, 2010 Report Share Posted October 12, 2010 I guess we just need to see what we can puch through a 300 micron filter then huh? I think by useing a synthetic coffe flavor or scent it would be different then and actual coffee ground into a lure. By doing so there would actually not be any coffe present in said bait,either ground in or present on the exterior.of said bait. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodkaman Posted October 13, 2010 Report Share Posted October 13, 2010 Oh, I had a much more devious thought. Not that simple Bob, they do tend to cover all the bases with these patent applications. Here is claim No2. 2. The fishing lure of claim 1 wherein the improvement further comprises said coffee material being selected from the group consisting of a particulate coffee material, a coffee oil, liquid coffee, synthetic coffee scent, or a combination thereof. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
biggun Posted October 13, 2010 Report Share Posted October 13, 2010 Not that simple Bob, they do tend to cover all the bases with these patent applications. Here is claim No2. Dave But yet it dosent say a synthetic coffe flavor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bryanmc Posted October 14, 2010 Report Share Posted October 14, 2010 But yet it dosent say a synthetic coffe flavor Just curious... what happens if you put instant coffee granules in hot plastisol? Will it dissolve and create a coffee scent at the same time, or turn into rocks? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodkaman Posted October 14, 2010 Report Share Posted October 14, 2010 Just curious... what happens if you put instant coffee granules in hot plastisol? Will it dissolve and create a coffee scent at the same time, or turn into rocks? Instant I use kopi luwak Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Prager Posted October 14, 2010 Report Share Posted October 14, 2010 Just curious... what happens if you put instant coffee granules in hot plastisol? Will it dissolve and create a coffee scent at the same time, or turn into rocks? I've ground fresh Columbian Coffee Beans to about the size of medium glitter (.035). It bleeds a little when using lighter colors. It gave a strong coffee smell that lasted about two weeks. Caught a few fish and my shop didn't smell like crawfish for a while! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madeye Posted October 14, 2010 Report Share Posted October 14, 2010 So what would happen if you sold some baits with coffe in them Does it mean they can sue you. And are patents world wide or just in USA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodkaman Posted October 14, 2010 Report Share Posted October 14, 2010 So what would happen if you sold some baits with coffe in them Does it mean they can sue you. And are patents world wide or just in USA Yes, the patent is current, they could sue you. On the patent is quoted two 'international classes', I don't know enough to comment on these or the coverage of the patent. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madeye Posted October 14, 2010 Report Share Posted October 14, 2010 You will have to excuse my ignorance as i have no knowledgeof patents and suing i very rare in Australia compared to USA. But lets say i start selling baits with coffee in them what could happen. Do they have to tell you to stop and give you a chance to do so before taking action. Or can they instantly take you to court. Cant ever imagine making enough from my baits to live on so would it be worth the court cost to sue me???? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodkaman Posted October 14, 2010 Report Share Posted October 14, 2010 I am not an expert either by any means. I like reading them and I have spoken to patent lawyers a couple of times for my own ideas. One thing they always say is do not show anyone your idea before it is protected. They talk a lot about not releasing it into the public domain, aparently this causes patent problems, if you have already shown your idea on say http://www.tackleunderground.com/community/topic/9555-interesting-article-on-scents/page__p__63175__hl__coffee__fromsearch__1#entry63175 unfortunately, the text of the introduction to coffee is missing. The significance of the date is that the patent was filed on 30th April 2007 and as far as I am aware, this is the important date. If coffee had been used by anyone before, it would surely have been mentioned on TU. So hats off to Troy Gibson for comming up with the idea. Regarding your question, from what I have seen around TU discussions, it is normal to get a 'cease and desist' warning letter first, whether that is a legal requirement I don't know. I am not going to tell you that you are safe, but I think they have enough battles trying to control the local market from infringing their patent. Personally I think the patent should be respected. Their are plenty more ideas to be discovered out there. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
earthworm77 Posted October 14, 2010 Report Share Posted October 14, 2010 Madeye, I think your safe. I do not think a patent can be enforced outside of the US. I have a mold of a popular bait and I know the bait is a product of Berkley Japan and the mold is not an infringement on any US patent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madeye Posted October 16, 2010 Report Share Posted October 16, 2010 preety sure i remember that post on coffe vodka. If i remeber corectly there was some talk of fish farmers using coffee to stimulate feeding. Thats when i started using coffee in my own baits. So there is a good chance i have been using coffee before the pattent. Unfortunatley i have no way of being sure. Main reason i am worried is that i have some people interested in me bottling the scent i use and seeling it. Thanks for the advice. to be honest scent is something i never thought would be an issue. I purposley make custom baits so as not to steal someones ideas or draw trouble to myself. Cant really veiw using a similar scent in the same vein though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
