Two Color Ripper Bait /production Video

[GB GONE]

here is some pictures my wife took last year after just 3 hours and 45 minutes with single cavity molds...this was by far our most productive moment but shows single cavity molds can produce great results. we used 6 each of 5 different baits or 30 molds total.

Just my point Jon. It can be done for sure and if the baits are smaller (cool faster) and each mold has 2, 3 or 4 baits, just think how many you could make. Laminates are slower but you can still crank them out once you get a system down.

Thanks for the great pic.

Jim

[Frank]

Great pic Jon that is alot of baits. Now one comment on at least one of those molds. The beast is one mold that I cant speed up. There is so much plastic you have to let it cool a long time before demolding. But as Jim says I do believe that bait count could be bettered by more cavitys in the mold. With two people there you have a great system but every time you open a mold is time and if you double the outtake think of the numbers then. This video I made is like I said before more like a one man band thing. If I had a partner that was serious as I am I to would have a system just like yours.

Now on mold count, to me anyways you only need enough molds so there is no idle time. And they only have to set long enough to demold without issue, then put it right back into rotation. So lets say with the beast mold you may need ten mold to inject then by the time you get to the tenth one you can demold. Is it really an advantage to have fifty and demold for a longer time. In this time everything has to be kept hot and cleaned out. In my video you may have noticed I have my mold on what looks like an aluminium table. It is actually that but it helps disipate heat from the mold so they wont get to hot and take longer to demold. It is raised and in the summer time I can run air below it to cool it off. Winter time no issue but the heat is there. So with my system I can use less molds and keep moving with no idle time. Like Jim says get a system that work for you, but try and keep an open mind for something new that will save you time. In production time is money. Hope this all makes sense. Frank

[GB GONE]

In my video you may have noticed I have my mold on what looks like an aluminium table. It is actually that but it helps disipate heat from the mold so they wont get to hot and take longer to demold. It is raised and in the summer time I can run air below it to cool it off.

I thought that was a raised area I was seeing Frank and had something similar incorporated into my new shop I just moved into. I have a 6' long raised stainless steel platform on my 10' counter. I raised mine only about an inch but might move it higher for the summer so I can run the air below.

Thanks again for doing the video as it helped me put together my system in my mind and in the new shop. You shortened the learning curve by months!

Jim

[tigerfire]

This is all great information! Sounds like I'm going to be struggling with injecting only 4oz of plastic at a time. I usually only hand pour 4oz at a time because that's all I need.

[Frank]

This is all great information! Sounds like I'm going to be struggling with injecting only 4oz of plastic at a time. I usually only hand pour 4oz at a time because that's all I need.

Yes it will be a strugle with 4 oz. Try double that and see how much easier it is till you get down to 4 oz or less. It is a breeze till then. And then you have to slow down because you suck the plastic so fast you will cause it to suck air in the injector. The faster you do it the worse it is. Some times it is and advantage to have a small injector like Del sells just to do small things. I use his 2 oz for my skirt molds because I do not need alot. Frank

[powerworm]

when i said 6 each i should have made it clearer we were using gangs of 6 each of those molds to be shot at 1 time there are 2 and a half full rotations as i can shoot baits faster than they can be demolded and it has come as a very big learning curve to be able to continuously do it. you have to have someone who can demold until you run out of plastic and we run 3 full presto pots when doing big runs like that. and regretfully those were all single color baits. the most we have done in 1 round of laminates was 411 in almost 90 minutes and that coulda been higher but my speed made some inferior baits but they still sold!! as for the beasts we have 18 of those molds i am trying to get rid of 6 if anyone needs a beast mold i can take less than what you can buy a new one even with the sale i have made enough money off of them to do it...let me know!!

[Frank]

I think me and Jim are on the same page here. We, I think are saying if the mold were two cavitys each for the laminates you in theory would have 822 baits in about the same time. Correct me if I understood you wrong Jim. Frank

[GB GONE]

That was my point Frank. Multi cavity molds multiply the results. My 3 and 4 cavity molds really kick the baits out!

Flip side is, that Beast would be a BEAST in a 2 cavity mold!!!

Still impressve to do that many laminates in that time. Shows a single person can get to far more tahn I am doing once you get things smoothed out.

Jim

[powerworm]

thing is if all of my molds were 2 cavity doesnt mean i would get twice the production. you still have to have enough plastic ready to go and you will be going back to fill your injector more often it seems it would all work out but i can give you a good example i use to have over 30 of dels 4 and 5" stick molds and i can do right at twice the baits with 9 hinged molds; now someone explain that one to me??? i cant i just know what works for me!

[Frank]

thing is if all of my molds were 2 cavity doesnt mean i would get twice the production. you still have to have enough plastic ready to go and you will be going back to fill your injector more often it seems it would all work out but i can give you a good example i use to have over 30 of dels 4 and 5" stick molds and i can do right at twice the baits with 9 hinged molds; now someone explain that one to me??? i cant i just know what works for me!

Ok you are right but think about it yes you will have to fill the injector twice as much and have twice as much plastic, because you will have twice the baits coming out. Dels molds have guide pins that come out so there is twice as many pieces to put back compared to say a mold with two nuts. But you dont have to use the nuts you can clamp six together just like you are now except maybe you will have to use two clamps on some molds with say 4 cavitys just because of the size. I am sure if you had asked Del to put guide pins that are stationary he would have for you. I understand you dont like the nuts and I dont have a problem with it but if I was doing as many baits as you I dont think the hinge is that much of an advantage over a clamp, but you still have to clamp yours too. My twinjector video show two four cavity molds with a two clamps no nuts, that is how I use molds with nuts if I have a large order. I do have some hinge mold so it is not like I dont have any. To demold them I have to get something to pry it open but with the other molds clamped I just pull it apart. One thing that can be difficult at times is the 4 cavity molds have a pretty good suction from the plastic shrinking. Sometimes it takes a little longer but you dont need tools. Frank

[mark poulson]

Yes it will be a strugle with 4 oz. Try double that and see how much easier it is till you get down to 4 oz or less. It is a breeze till then. And then you have to slow down because you suck the plastic so fast you will cause it to suck air in the injector. The faster you do it the worse it is. Some times it is and advantage to have a small injector like Del sells just to do small things. I use his 2 oz for my skirt molds because I do not need alot. Frank

So how did it take you to pour all the clear/black flake skirts you made for me?

[powerworm]

i have 6 of dels plug craw 2 cavity molds and i use clamps on them like you said but they are a real pain to pull apart. i had local shop press in locate pins for me only charged me 20 plus the pins no big expense there it is faster to get them together that way but getting them apart i use an aluminum 1/2" rod and wedge it in the plastic in the sprue and pry but not hard enough to damage anything these molds are tough to damage

[Frank]

So how did it take you to pour all the clear/black flake skirts you made for me?

When I do thing for people as a favor, I have to admit I use remelts but people cant tell. Your skirts were what is called a core shot, I poured a little black is the sprue then followed it with the clear. I did use the 2oz but it does not use much plastic at all. On another note with clear I dont use it again due to its yellowing I just add color and pour something else with it.

All mold makers are a little differant and a system can be used. You all just have to find one that works with what you have at the time. But keep an open mind for new ways and some day it will work for you too. Everything I am asked to make does not come from the same mold maker so I have to adapt a system that will work for me. Alot of molds does not always equal alot of baits if there is alot of idle time. I would love to see what you all can do with what you have. I have talked to alot of people about this lately and seems that everybody has a differant set of obsticles to over come. Frank

[GB GONE]

No matter what anyone tells me, I know I can make more baits with a multi-cavity mold vs a one cavity mold. I do it everyday. You just prep for using more plastic if you have high cavity molds. De-molding is demolding. Takes the same time to open a mold with one bait as it does with 3 baits inside. Production is just a numbers game and as you increase molds, you increase the plastic available, that equals more baits per hour.

Jim

PS CCM has a small place on their molds for a screw driver tip to go into to twist to open the molds. Still have to clamp them on the one end.

Edited December 18, 2010 by ghostbaits

[SHK]

PS CCM has a small place on their molds for a screw driver tip to go into to twist to open the molds. Still have to clamp them on the one end.

CCM's basic mold design is Chris/Bears. he just changed the hinge

[GB GONE]

CCM's basic mold design is Chris/Bears. he just changed the hinge

LOL.. The "basic mold" you speak of, is that the aluminum part, the square part, the part with the 5/8" port or what? All injection molds are of the "basic design"!

If you are insinuating that CCM has somehow copied Bears mold design, that is lame.

Unique thing about Jason at CCM is that he is creating unique bait designs vs copying existing baits or existing ideas. Gotta respect that regardless. Do you own a CCM or are you just trying to put his molds down for a certain reason?

I actually own Del's, Basstackles, Bears and CCMs so I can talk about the diffences from first hand experience. They all have positives and negatives but all make nice stuff!

Be nice to hear information regarding the production of 2 color baits with few molds as that is the topic at hand, not knocking someone's molds.

Jim

[SHK]

LOL.. The "basic mold" you speak of, is that the aluminum part, the square part, the part with the 5/8" port or what? All injection molds are of the "basic design"!

If you are insinuating that CCM has somehow copied Bears mold design, that is lame.

Unique thing about Jason at CCM is that he is creating unique bait designs vs copying existing baits or existing ideas. Gotta respect that regardless. Do you own a CCM or are you just trying to put his molds down for a certain reason?

I actually own Del's, Basstackles, Bears and CCMs so I can talk about the diffences from first hand experience. They all have positives and negatives but all make nice stuff!

Be nice to hear information regarding the production of 2 color baits with few molds as that is the topic at hand, not knocking someone's molds.

Jim

simmer down a bit, wasnt knocking his molds at all, just stating a fact that the little slot in his molds was actually copied it self.

i have actually at one time owned all the above molds as well as a few others.

as far as 2 color production goes, Bear's original adaptor set up with the med injectors, i find its far easier to manoeuvre the whole set up. I found that once i learned to use it properly it produces quite consistent laminates.

[Frank]

CCM's basic mold design is Chris/Bears. he just changed the hinge

I thought it was a do-it mold design first. I think they have been in business longer havent they? I dont think we want to get into mold history here, you may not like what you hear. Frank

[SHK]

I thought it was a do-it mold design first. I think they have been in business longer havent they? I dont think we want to get into mold history here, you may not like what you hear. Frank

may be Frank, no skin off my back.

[GB GONE]

Yeah no reason to get into that Frank cause Collins & Do-It used the hinge far before Bear...

Why simmer down when your initial post is an attack on CCM vs information on the topic at hand? Don't get into the "he copied deal" as there will be hurt feelings.

As you say in your post "I found that once i learned to use it properly it produces quite consistent laminates."

Frank has shown by his video that indeed this block works well if used properly. The proof is there on the screen.

Obviously, the blending block idea must be a good idea as it is now being offered by Bear. If the blending block was inferior, there would be no reason to make and sell them.

Jim

[mark poulson]

Forgive a hobby pourer's question, but doesn't adding hinges increase the labor in the manuf. process? I mean, every step takes time.

I added a hinge to my first POP mold, but found that locating pins, in my case cut off nails, worked as well, and was much faster to actually make the mold.

[GB GONE]

Only problem with a hinged mold is, if it gets dropped or twisted. Once the hinge is off center, you have to clamp the crap out of it to get baits without flashing. I was in the process of buying a used hinged mold and the seller dropped it prior to ship. Deal off as the mold was not usable according to seller.

Seems putting the hinge in is just a matter of programming just like the mold cavity.

If it was my call Mark, I'd make the molds with just a couple centering pins and nothing else. Clamps are effective for me.

Jim

spelling

Edited December 20, 2010 by ghostbaits

[SHK]

Yeah no reason to get into that Frank cause Collins & Do-It used the hinge far before Bear...

Why simmer down when your initial post is an attack on CCM vs information on the topic at hand? Don't get into the "he copied deal" as there will be hurt feelings.

As you say in your post "I found that once i learned to use it properly it produces quite consistent laminates."

Frank has shown by his video that indeed this block works well if used properly. The proof is there on the screen.

Obviously, the blending block idea must be a good idea as it is now being offered by Bear. If the blending block was inferior, there would be no reason to make and sell them.

Jim

hurt feelings? no need to get your panties in a bunch Jim. Lets see here, you mentioned a slot in CCM's molds to stick a screwdriver into to pop the mold open right? i said nothing about the hinge, i know where CHRIS got that idea. and no it wasnt an attack on his molds either, your trying to turn it into one, if i wanted to turn this into an attack i would list the issues i had with his molds but this isnt the place for it.

back to the topic

Franks video does indeed show that he has worked out a method that works for him. it didnt work for me, its all i was saying.

[GB GONE]

Franks video does indeed show that he has worked out a method that works for him. it didnt work for me, its all i was saying.

Little stuff like your comment does start things, especially since there was so much clammor about Frank's method not working and the duel adapter being the only way to accomplish production laminates by hand injection. He did the video in direct response to the notion that the blending block would not work. Just real curious that the idea Basstackle had that was ridiculed publically on this forum, is now being embraced.

As far as the screwdriver deal, mention CCM as using the idea. I can put a list on here of the ideas "borrowed" from Zoom, Culprit, LC, M-F, Del, Bear, Basstackle, Bass Assassin, Srtike King, Yamamoto, etc. Still don't get your point other than to attempt to "wad panties". What was your point on that specifically?

I am just interested in producing baits in the most time effective manner that are of the highest quality. Especially laminates. If one method works over another, I am going to use it. Each manufacturer here has things that work great and it helps to see the results here on TU.

Make a video of your production method and post it up so I can see how well it works. Maybe I and others will consider switching if the baits can be produced as rapidly and with the same reliability/quality.

Jim

[SHK]

Little stuff like your comment does start things, especially since there was so much clammor about Frank's method not working and the duel adapter being the only way to accomplish production laminates by hand injection. He did the video in direct response to the notion that the blending block would not work. Just real curious that the idea Basstackle had that was ridiculed publically on this forum, is now being embraced.

As far as the screwdriver deal, mention CCM as using the idea. I can put a list on here of the ideas "borrowed" from Zoom, Culprit, LC, M-F, Del, Bear, Basstackle, Bass Assassin, Srtike King, Yamamoto, etc. Still don't get your point other than to attempt to "wad panties". What was your point on that specifically?

I am just interested in producing baits in the most time effective manner that are of the highest quality. Especially laminates. If one method works over another, I am going to use it. Each manufacturer here has things that work great and it helps to see the results here on TU.

Make a video of your production method and post it up so I can see how well it works. Maybe I and others will consider switching if the baits can be produced as rapidly and with the same reliability/quality.

Jim

my method has already been posted over on bears forum.

on the mold, i was just stating a fact, plain and simple, you are the one that is making a huge deal out of it, not me.

Frank, i did want to thank you though, i borrowed your hot plate idea and it works wonders. Thanks