Zebulon29 Posted January 9, 2011 Report Share Posted January 9, 2011 I have now coated 5 different baits with d2t. My first bait went really well, 2 fish eyes, no lumps, and completely cured. Ever since, I have had nothing but issues. I have a lure turner built and am using it. The last 4 baits I have tried to coat have been very lumpy in spots, had multiple fish eyes, and the d2t remains sticky after over 48 hours. It leaves a fingerprint without giving any pressure to the coating. Any ideas on what I am doing wrong? I have not been thinning it. I have tried putting on a thin coat and a thick coat(seemed thick). Thanks for the replies guys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark poulson Posted January 9, 2011 Report Share Posted January 9, 2011 I have now coated 5 different baits with d2t. My first bait went really well, 2 fish eyes, no lumps, and completely cured. Ever since, I have had nothing but issues. I have a lure turner built and am using it. The last 4 baits I have tried to coat have been very lumpy in spots, had multiple fish eyes, and the d2t remains sticky after over 48 hours. It leaves a fingerprint without giving any pressure to the coating. Any ideas on what I am doing wrong? I have not been thinning it. I have tried putting on a thin coat and a thick coat(seemed thick). Thanks for the replies guys. I would guess that the fish eyes are from some kind of contamination, like finger prints, and the lumpy finish is from applying it too thick. The soft surface sounds like you either didn't measure your ingredients right, or you didn't mix them well enough. You can try wearing cheap latex gloves to handle you lures while you're painting, and after you've painted them. Brushing out the epoxy, and cleaning your brush back into the mixing cup, will help to thin your coats. I usually measure my two parts by laying down two parallel lines onto some tape I put onto my workbench for mixing when I'm mixing D2T for gluing. For top coating, I do the same in the bottom of a small salsa cup, and mix it with a paper clip wire, being sure to get into all the edges of the cup so the material is really well mixed. I use a hair dryer to get rid of any bubbles that occur when I mix. All of the stuff I just mentioned I learned here from other TU members, and from making a shload of mistakes. And I Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobP Posted January 9, 2011 Report Share Posted January 9, 2011 Failure of epoxy to harden is caused 99% of the time by one of 2 things: Not mixing the epoxy really well or not measuring the hardener/resin exactly enough. D2T will stand a little fudging on the measurement side but it is more viscous than other topcoat epoxies and requires really thorough mixing. If it has lumps and is not curing, bad mixing is probably the culprit. If you're mixing in cool temps, a FEW drops of denatured alcohol will thin the mix and make it easier to blend without introducing a lot of air bubbles. It also extends the brush time so you don't have to be in a panic to get it mixed and on the lure. Lastly, a sanity check - be sure you didn't use Devcon 5 Minute Epoxy instead of the correct Devcon Two Ton epoxy. Been there, done that! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zebulon29 Posted January 9, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 9, 2011 Thanks for the help guys. I had to look up what denatured alcohol was. Where do you guys buy this?? Would a hardware store or wal-mart carry it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayburnGuy Posted January 9, 2011 Report Share Posted January 9, 2011 Thanks for the help guys. I had to look up what denatured alcohol was. Where do you guys buy this?? Would a hardware store or wal-mart carry it? Most hardware stores, or anywhere that sells paint, will have denatured alcohol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zebulon29 Posted January 10, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 10, 2011 Alright, I got everything set up to try this again within the next couple of days. Got some denatured alcohol as well. I will post my results and hopefully it goes a lot better from now on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zebulon29 Posted January 10, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 10, 2011 Got another done last night. Everything went really smooth. It had a couple of "burrs" on it but overall was really nice. No fish eyes, pits, or lumps. Thanks a lot guys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j27 Posted January 11, 2011 Report Share Posted January 11, 2011 Got another done last night. Everything went really smooth. It had a couple of "burrs" on it but overall was really nice. No fish eyes, pits, or lumps. Thanks a lot guys. I'm new to this too and just went through that same issues. Just liked to share that I've been experimenting with Evirotex Lite and D2T. My expereince with the e-tex was a little better than D2t. First of all, you don't have to worry about thinning it and your working time is longer. E-tex takes longer to cure but worth the wait. Couldn't tell any difference in the end results though. Good luck!!! IS IT SPRING TIME YET ??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muskydan666 Posted January 11, 2011 Report Share Posted January 11, 2011 I'm new to this too and just went through that same issues. Just liked to share that I've been experimenting with Evirotex Lite and D2T. My expereince with the e-tex was a little better than D2t. First of all, you don't have to worry about thinning it and your working time is longer. E-tex takes longer to cure but worth the wait. Couldn't tell any difference in the end results though. Good luck!!! IS IT SPRING TIME YET ??? Why spring time???Your in s.carolina!!!lol!!Come here in Quebec and will see what is winter!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j27 Posted January 11, 2011 Report Share Posted January 11, 2011 Why spring time???Your in s.carolina!!!lol!!Come here in Quebec and will see what is winter!!! HA HA HA HA!!!!!!, Thats true, but right now we have about 8 inches snow and ice and I don't think I could get the boat in the water. If it was'nt for that I'd be out there. The bite is just a little better in spring. I do feel sorry for you guys up north, this kind of weather sucks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chas888 Posted January 11, 2011 Report Share Posted January 11, 2011 I read a lot about D2T...why cant you use polyurethane to coat baits? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j27 Posted January 12, 2011 Report Share Posted January 12, 2011 I read a lot about D2T...why cant you use polyurethane to coat baits? The polyurethane that I tryed never got hard enough, too soft after curing. Good for floors, bad for lures.When I tryed to fish with them the colors got cloudy and the hooks kept sticking in the bait. And thats after they dryed for 2 weeks. There is lots and lots of info on this on TU. I just wished I found TU before I started making cranks, It would have saved me about $30. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayburnGuy Posted January 12, 2011 Report Share Posted January 12, 2011 Just like everything else, not all urethanes are created equally. Some will work for what we do and some not so much. There are volumes written about top coats in the archives. It seems that just about everything that could be used for top coating lures has been tried at one time or another. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skeeter Posted January 22, 2011 Report Share Posted January 22, 2011 I agree about the mixing. You are not mixing it thoroughly enough. A possible reason for any clots or really fast curing is humidity. Devcon works best around 72 deg. and 50% humidity. If the humidity is too low then it will clot and pull off of the bait in chunks with the brush. Skeeter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobP Posted January 22, 2011 Report Share Posted January 22, 2011 HA HA HA HA!!!!!!, Thats true, but right now we have about 8 inches snow and ice and I don't think I could get the boat in the water. If it was'nt for that I'd be out there. The bite is just a little better in spring. I do feel sorry for you guys up north, this kind of weather sucks. Feel no sorrow for northern fishermen! Yeah, unless they want to ice fish, they're out of luck Nov-Apr. On the other hand, their lakes are less crowded during the fishing season and after the long winter break, the fish have forgotten what a lure is. I sneak up there every chance I get to reeducate some of the bass and pike population. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gunnie3035 Posted January 23, 2011 Report Share Posted January 23, 2011 Alright, I got everything set up to try this again within the next couple of days. Got some denatured alcohol as well. I will post my results and hopefully it goes a lot better from now on. Guess I will go against the grain here. I think your changing the strength of epoxy when you thin it. If you want it thinner just heat it up with a blow dryer. Also run a blow dryer over your bait a little before putting it on the turner. This will even it all out and get rid of any bubbles. Lumps can also be caused by continuing to work 2-ton after it starts to harden. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobP Posted January 23, 2011 Report Share Posted January 23, 2011 Gunnie, I understand your concern about thinning. Skeeter probably agrees and he's maybe topcoated more baits with D2T than anyone on TU. But if you are literally a garage builder, IMO there aren't many viable alternatives. Heat lowers the viscosity for a few moments but just makes the epoxy cure faster. That pressures you to get it on the lure even faster than the couple of minutes you had before. I don't hesitate to stir in a few drops of denatured alcohol to get D2T to brush easier in cool temps and honestly can't tell any difference in durability from lures I brush with straight D2T on hot summer days. Lots of guys use Etex or various rod epoxies - all of which are solvent modified. I like D2T because I have experience with it, but solvent modified epoxies like Etex are still popular with many guys who build hard working musky baits and that speaks to its durability. More epoxy finishes are ruined or weakened by poor mixing, poor measuring, or using the wrong solvent than the differences we're talking about here, so my advice is: Measure it correctly, mix the hell out of it... then thin it as little as you must to get it on the lure without an anxiety attack. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rotorhead Posted January 24, 2011 Report Share Posted January 24, 2011 I would guess that the fish eyes are from some kind of contamination, like finger prints, and the lumpy finish is from applying it too thick. The soft surface sounds like you either didn't measure your ingredients right, or you didn't mix them well enough. You can try wearing cheap latex gloves to handle you lures while you're painting, and after you've painted them. Brushing out the epoxy, and cleaning your brush back into the mixing cup, will help to thin your coats. I usually measure my two parts by laying down two parallel lines onto some tape I put onto my workbench for mixing when I'm mixing D2T for gluing. For top coating, I do the same in the bottom of a small salsa cup, and mix it with a paper clip wire, being sure to get into all the edges of the cup so the material is really well mixed. I use a hair dryer to get rid of any bubbles that occur when I mix. All of the stuff I just mentioned I learned here from other TU members, and from making a shload of mistakes. And I Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rotorhead Posted January 24, 2011 Report Share Posted January 24, 2011 When you mix D2T as well as E-Tex you have to be 100% correct on your measurements. I have found and now use small measuring cups made of plastic that I buy from the drug stores located around most hospitals. It is the same cups that you would get medication in if you were a patient. They are graduated in teaspoon measurements, are very accurate and best of all cheap to purchase. My mixing problems went away as soon as I started using the cups. I also found them at stores that sell model plane supplies. They are used to mix model epoxy. I bought about a hundred for less that $5.00. I use stirring sticks I pick-up from the local Chicken sandwich shop to mix with. Also your body excretes enough body oil thru your fingers to contaminate the lure bodies which causes fish eye and other drying problems. As others have said latex gloves are useful when holding the lure bodies. Hope this is helpful. Rotorhead Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skeeter Posted January 26, 2011 Report Share Posted January 26, 2011 (edited) BobP hit the nail on the head. I have been using Devcon for over 10 yrs. I have done everything in the world to the stuff. Heating it causes it to run. A normal speed drying wheel will not spin quickly enough to even it out. It also causes it to cure prematurely and will not be as tough. You can maybe thin it some. But I just get the temp and humidity right in the room that I work in to get it put on properly. Also... the brush that you use to apply it makes a difference also. Skeeter Edited January 26, 2011 by Skeeter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J's Muskie Customs Posted January 26, 2011 Report Share Posted January 26, 2011 (edited) BobP hit the nail on the head. I have been using Devcon for over 10 yrs. I have done everything in the world to the stuff. Heating it causes it to run. A normal speed drying wheel will not spin quickly enough to even it out. It also causes it to cure prematurely and will not be as tough. You can maybe thin it some. But I just get the temp and humidity right in the room that I work in to get it put on properly. Also... the brush that you use to apply it makes a difference also. Skeeter hey guys i use envirotex and am kicking myself in the arse for buying another half gallon of the stuff! i used the devcon last night on a glider for the first time and all i have to say is i am devcon all the way now!!!! stuff is so easy to put on and smoothes itself out real good! I have a question,, how long do you keep your turner on after application? the envirotex i let run all night. here is a glider i did last night with the devcon...first time using it,,,look how smooth it went on..insane.. oh and one more ?, where do you guys get your 2t at? Edited January 26, 2011 by J's Muskie Customs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayburnGuy Posted January 26, 2011 Report Share Posted January 26, 2011 D2T should be set up enough in about 30 minutes that it will no longer sag or run. A couple ways of checking to be sure was discussed just recently. One is to leave whatever D2T you have left in a small container and when it's set up enough to no longer be fluid you can switch your turner off. This keeps you from having to touch the bait and leaving fingerprints on it. I buy my D2T in the 9 oz. bottles from the link below. Ben http://www.texaswoodcarvers.com/Tool_Catalog/Adhesives.htm#Epoxy%20Glue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobP Posted January 26, 2011 Report Share Posted January 26, 2011 (edited) I leave the lure turner on for at least an hour, usually more. D2T takes 5-7 hrs to cure to a "touch-able" state and like Etex, takes 24 hrs to reach 90% cure. Messing with it in the meantime just leads to unhappy endings. I keep the unused epoxy to judge how the cure is going too. But there's a stage during the cure when I've checked the remainder, thought it was hard enough to turn off the turner, but found my 'expert sense of touch' wasn't so expert after all. Building crankbaits will eventually teach you patience; it's just a matter of how many crankbaits you ruin before you learn the lesson. Edited January 26, 2011 by BobP Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmmb Posted January 26, 2011 Report Share Posted January 26, 2011 I leave the lure turner on for at least an hour, usually more. D2T takes 5-7 hrs to cure to a "touch-able" state and like Etex, takes 24 hrs to reach 90% cure. Messing with it in the meantime just leads to unhappy endings. How long do you have to wait before fishiing a bait with D2T. I am new to this and trying different topcoats. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobv Posted January 26, 2011 Report Share Posted January 26, 2011 hey guys i use envirotex and am kicking myself in the arse for buying another half gallon of the stuff! i used the devcon last night on a glider for the first time and all i have to say is i am devcon all the way now!!!! stuff is so easy to put on and smoothes itself out real good! I have a question,, how long do you keep your turner on after application? the envirotex i let run all night. here is a glider i did last night with the devcon...first time using it,,,look how smooth it went on..insane.. oh and one more ?, where do you guys get your 2t at? Don't throw out your Etex yet, I have found the D2T to be more brittle than Etex or other "table top" epoxies. I do like how easy D2t is to use but when durability is a concern I use Etex or System 3 epoxy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
