Pledge With Future Shine As A Thinner

[Brent R]

I read on some other airbrush sites, that Pledge with future shine is a good paint thinner and it also make your paint flow a lot better.....Also you don't get tip dry when using it......Should would like to know if anyone has tried it, and what was the results you got from using it.

Thanks Brent

[gunnr]

Try this http://www.tackleunderground.com/community/topic/20873-some-createx-thinning-information/page__p__155801__hl__future__fromsearch__1#entry155801

If the link doesn't work, use the search under "createx thinning information". I think there's like two pages of replies. I use it and have had good luck with it.

Edited March 26, 2011 by gunnr

[21xdc]

I read on some other airbrush sites, that Pledge with future shine is a good paint thinner and it also make your paint flow a lot better.....Also you don't get tip dry when using it......Should would like to know if anyone has tried it, and what was the results you got from using it.

Thanks Brent

I have been using it and like the results... Watch this>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zZrmNjQYcdg

[BobP]

I would say Pledge is more a flow enhancer or paint extender rather than a thinning agent. It's viscosity is actually a bit higher than I would use to shoot fine detail. If you look at the video, you'll notice the formula is 50% paint, 30% water, and 20% Pledge. If you thin paint 50% with water, it will likely not form a coherent film when you shoot it on a crankbait. Substitute Pledge for part of the water and you get paint that is 70% acrylic finish and only 30% water. Works pretty smooth.

I use it now in most of my Createx colors and like the effect. And it makes your paint go farther. But don't over-do it - 20-25% Pledge is plenty. I haven't noticed pro or con regarding tip drying. It dries to a somewhat harder, more durable film than regular airbrush paint, which is good on the lure but maybe not so good in the airbrush if you have bad cleaning habits.

[Brent R]

I would say Pledge is more a flow enhancer or paint extender rather than a thinning agent. It's viscosity is actually a bit higher than I would use to shoot fine detail. If you look at the video, you'll notice the formula is 50% paint, 30% water, and 20% Pledge. If you thin paint 50% with water, it will likely not form a coherent film when you shoot it on a crankbait. Substitute Pledge for part of the water and you get paint that is 70% acrylic finish and only 30% water. Works pretty smooth.

I use it now in most of my Createx colors and like the effect. And it makes your paint go farther. But don't over-do it - 20-25% Pledge is plenty. I haven't noticed pro or con regarding tip drying. It dries to a somewhat harder, more durable film than regular airbrush paint, which is good on the lure but maybe not so good in the airbrush if you have bad cleaning habits.

Thanks for your reply.....the site i saw this on does not put any water to the mix at all...The mix ratio they used was 2 to 1..that is 2 part paint....They also said as far as tip dry...there was little to none..leaning more to the none side...They have also done test on about 10 other produces and none compared to using pledge.....and pledge was a lot cheaper.....My main concern was about the effects to your airbrush.....it seems like if you aloud this to dry in your brush would it cause your needle to stick in your airbrush. Would be glad to here about your experiences using pledge...Also how you cleaned your airbrush....Thanks Bob for your input.

Brent

[BobP]

Thanks for your reply.....the site i saw this on does not put any water to the mix at all...The mix ratio they used was 2 to 1..that is 2 part paint....They also said as far as tip dry...there was little to none..leaning more to the none side...They have also done test on about 10 other produces and none compared to using pledge.....and pledge was a lot cheaper.....My main concern was about the effects to your airbrush.....it seems like if you aloud this to dry in your brush would it cause your needle to stick in your airbrush. Would be glad to here about your experiences using pledge...Also how you cleaned your airbrush....Thanks Bob for your input.

Brent

I had it dry in the packing behind the cup of my Iwata one time and it took some force to pull the needle out of the brush. Not like a grown man can't break it free and pull out the needle, but it was glued in there and that never happened until I started using Pledge. I clean my a/b well at the end of a session but had not been paying enough attention to the barrel, just the cup and front end. Clean between colors as you normally would but rinse the a/b thoroughly after use, and it won't hurt to wipe a drop of oil down the needle. I shoot a little acetone through mine before I put it up to make sure everything is cleaned out. I guess you could use the same chemicals prescribed on the Pledge bottle to clean the a/b but if they include ammonia, it will eventually de-chrome the brush. Bottom line for me is the Pledge works well and it doesn't really take much extra effort to live with it.

[Brent R]

I had it dry in the packing behind the cup of my Iwata one time and it took some force to pull the needle out of the brush. Not like a grown man can't break it free and pull out the needle, but it was glued in there and that never happened until I started using Pledge. I clean my a/b well at the end of a session but had not been paying enough attention to the barrel, just the cup and front end. Clean between colors as you normally would but rinse the a/b thoroughly after use, and it won't hurt to wipe a drop of oil down the needle. I shoot a little acetone through mine before I put it up to make sure everything is cleaned out. I guess you could use the same chemicals prescribed on the Pledge bottle to clean the a/b but if they include ammonia, it will eventually de-chrome the brush. Bottom line for me is the Pledge works well and it doesn't really take much extra effort to live with it.

Thanks for the info Bob....i think i will give it a try.......

[mark poulson]

Bob,

Could you use the Pledge straight as a clear?

[BobP]

Bob,

Could you use the Pledge straight as a clear?

I haven't tried it (don't use clears) but don't see why not. If you use it as a barrier coating, it should be stronger than most acrylic clear paints. The discussions I've seen on other sites mentions its use as a "masking agent" - whatever that means!

[dhockey11]

I haven't tried it (don't use clears) but don't see why not. If you use it as a barrier coating, it should be stronger than most acrylic clear paints. The discussions I've seen on other sites mentions its use as a "masking agent" - whatever that means!

You can use Future as a clear. Many model airplanes are finished with this only. I prefer to brush it on because it does make cleaning the a/b more difficult, and it self levels very well. I also use Future if i decide I want to add glitter (very fine) or want to use an oil based "inking" technique to enhance any textured details on the bait. What they mean by "masking agent" is that masking tape seals much better on Future than the regular paint leading to much sharper masking lines. It also is stronger and doesn't lift when the tape is removed.

Zack

[mark poulson]

You can use Future as a clear. Many model airplanes are finished with this only. I prefer to brush it on because it does make cleaning the a/b more difficult, and it self levels very well. I also use Future if i decide I want to add glitter (very fine) or want to use an oil based "inking" technique to enhance any textured details on the bait. What they mean by "masking agent" is that masking tape seals much better on Future than the regular paint leading to much sharper masking lines. It also is stronger and doesn't lift when the tape is removed.

Zack

Zack,

Can you dip it, and how long does it take to dry?

[capt mike]

Zack,

Can you dip it, and how long does it take to dry?

I've been using it (future floor) in my auto air with no problems. Actually it solved some problems. After watching the utube video a few months back, I realized I was not thinning the paint enough. As a true green horn, it helped me for sure.

I'm interested in hearing what you guys find out about using future floor as a clear coat. Are you talking about the final coat or an in-between coat?

P.S. -Mark, I cut out my first PVC blanks last night..on your recommendation. I dont know what brand it is but it cuts, looks and feels like wood. Smells like plastic when you cut it.

[BobP]

I've been using it (future floor) in my auto air with no problems. Actually it solved some problems. After watching the utube video a few months back, I realized I was not thinning the paint enough. As a true green horn, it helped me for sure.

I'm interested in hearing what you guys find out about using future floor as a clear coat. Are you talking about the final coat or an in-between coat?

P.S. -Mark, I cut out my first PVC blanks last night..on your recommendation. I dont know what brand it is but it cuts, looks and feels like wood. Smells like plastic when you cut it.

In-between only. Water resistant is not waterproof. Some use clear acrylic paint (or Pledge) as an intermediate clearcoat to protect the underlying paint in case they have to rinse off a later "goof".

[mark poulson]

In-between only. Water resistant is not waterproof. Some use clear acrylic paint (or Pledge) as an intermediate clearcoat to protect the underlying paint in case they have to rinse off a later "goof".

Bob,

If you add Pledge to Createx, does it interfer with the heat-triggered cross link that makes T shirt paints waterproof?

I apologize for appointing you the "Pledge expert", but I'm hoping you've done the hard work, and already know the answer.

[dhockey11]

Zack,

Can you dip it, and how long does it take to dry?

I'm sure you can dip a bait, but id be worried about the coating being too thick. My brushed on coatings dry in abt 20mins, a dipped coat may take longer. Again, this is not a final clear coat like devcon or etex. I can dip a practice bait today and see how it goes.

Zack

[BobP]

Bob,

If you add Pledge to Createx, does it interfer with the heat-triggered cross link that makes T shirt paints waterproof?

I apologize for appointing you the "Pledge expert", but I'm hoping you've done the hard work, and already know the answer.

Honestly, I got no idea! But it is more durable than acrylic paint alone. One question I have about "heat cured" Createx: do guys think hitting a bait with a hair dryer cross-links, melts (or whatever chemical/physical process) Createx as if they were ironing it on a T-shirt? Any objective evidence for that? I'm wondering because I seem to remember that Createx recommends a ironing temp that is considerably above what you can achieve with a hair dryer. I use a hair dryer after every paint shot but to me, it's just a way to speed dry the paint and move on to the next shot.

ps - I just started playing around with Pledge a month ago so if you want a 'hard working expert', you're barking up the wrong tree! Signed: Lazy Hobby Guy

[Vodkaman]

Honestly, I got no idea! But it is more durable than acrylic paint alone. One question I have about "heat cured" Createx: do guys think hitting a bait with a hair dryer cross-links, melts (or whatever chemical/physical process) Createx as if they were ironing it on a T-shirt? Any objective evidence for that? I'm wondering because I seem to remember that Createx recommends a ironing temp that is considerably above what you can achieve with a hair dryer. I use a hair dryer after every paint shot but to me, it's just a way to speed dry the paint and move on to the next shot.

That is a hard one to prove. But heat setting advice seems to have solved a lot of top coat problems. I cannot remember anyone comming back and saying 'that did not work'.

On a general note - if any piece of advice works or doesn't work, you should come back to the thread and say so. Feedback is very important and teaches us all something.

Dave

[SmokeyJ]

Honestly, I got no idea! But it is more durable than acrylic paint alone. One question I have about "heat cured" Createx: do guys think hitting a bait with a hair dryer cross-links, melts (or whatever chemical/physical process) Createx as if they were ironing it on a T-shirt? Any objective evidence for that? I'm wondering because I seem to remember that Createx recommends a ironing temp that is considerably above what you can achieve with a hair dryer. I use a hair dryer after every paint shot but to me, it's just a way to speed dry the paint and move on to the next shot.

ps - I just started playing around with Pledge a month ago so if you want a 'hard working expert', you're barking up the wrong tree! Signed: Lazy Hobby Guy

The Createx application guide on their website says the following:

Heat Gun: apply heat at a low to mid-temperature setting no more than 300°F. Keep air moving to avoid blistering. Apply heat until paint is warm to the touch.

I think a hairdryer could probably get to a similar temp if guys are hitting them for long enough, but that is pure speculation on my part.

[dhockey11]

As I mentioned earlier, I did dip a bait today in Future. It took less than 1 hr to completely dry, and the coat wasn't as thick as I thought it would be (no precise measurements, sorry =P) since a lot of the excess just dripped off. The only problem I had was that the hook eyes got clogged, but a little poke with a pen cleaned it all out, super easy. So yes, you can dip baits in Future and its incredibly easy. Every time I use this stuff I am amazed at its versatility for hobbyists.

Zack

[68KingFisher]

One question I have about "heat cured" Createx: do guys think hitting a bait with a hair dryer cross-links, melts (or whatever chemical/physical process) Createx as if they were ironing it on a T-shirt? Any objective evidence for that?

Bob, in the "for what its worth dept", I've been using Createx on both tee shirts, leather jackets and hard objects(mostly helmets) since the mid 80's. I've seen the effects heat treating has on items vs not heat treating.....and from my experience the difference is night and day.

Createx will wash out of a tee shirt the first time you pop it in the washing machine if it hasn't been heat set. But if heat set to proper temps the paint will stay for years.....I've got tee shirts with airbrushed artwork done with Createx thats 20+ years old and the paint still looks pretty good....a few that I never wore very often still look almost as good as the day they were airbrushed.

Additionally when dealing with garments and ironing or, in the case of a shop situation we used heat presses to set the paint, you have heat and pressure involved, and its very obvious that pressure makes a big difference too....Now, when I hand iron a tee shirt I use as much bodyweight as my wifes ironing board can stand, and in some cases i'll iron against a solid table top so I can really bear down with as much pressure as I can.....this realy makes Createx adhere to the fabric longer.

Now, my experience with Createx on hard surfaces applies mostly to my custom painted helmets I do for bikers and racers mostly....Although I now primarily use urethanes I've painted many, many helmets with Createx, and lots of plastic ball helmets for kids, and the same thing applies. If Createx is heat set to a good "HOT" temp, then it will adhere very well indeed.

The reason I make that statement, is because I've sanded helmets painted with Createx thats been heated vs unheated and in every case it was more difficult to remove the heatset paint vs the non heatset paint.

Now, having said that, I will follow up by saying that just lightly blowing a little warm air ain't gonna cut it in my opinion, and since I can't iron a helmet or crankbait using both heat and pressure, I just use a heat gun and I set it hot....not mild, not med, HOT.....med/bright glowing orange elements inside the heatgun and it will burn your skin if your not careful.....On a setting of 1-10 with 10 being the hottest I run at 6-7 most of the time...occasionally hotter if i'm working a bigger area.

Now I kinda start with the gun held back aways and I paint with the heat...back and forth...never remaining in one spot for more then a second or so, and as my object begins to warm up i'll move the gun closer and speed up my movements so I don't blister the paint.....Once the item is "HOT" to the touch its done....and I do mean HOT.

I've used this process on countless helmets, a few motorcycles and automobiles and couple of dirt track sprintcars, all painted with Createx, and Createx Auto Air....and yes, even a handfull of Crankbaits, and its worked very well for me.

So do I think heat setting Createx vs not makes a difference......"Yes sir".....I certainly do.

[BobP]

Kingfisher, thanks for the insight. I give baits a pretty good blast with a hair dryer but it's not the same as using a heat gun. One thing I always worry about is hitting a wood bait too hard with heat and forcing interior air to bubble the undercoating and paint. That can happen even if the bait is undercoated with epoxy since the heat can soften the epoxy and the air pressure inside accumulates at end grain areas.

Like you, my attitude is based on removing finishes I've previously applied. Mostly I depend on the topcoat to keep paint on the bait. Dick Nite S-81 is my gold standard for adhesion. I use a mishmash of paint brands including taxidermy paint and the DN soaks into the paint and down to the substrate to form a very durable unified finish similar to factory finished baits (and sometimes better). Epoxy is different because it never penetrates very far into the paint layer. My attitude has been that as long as the epoxy holds up, no problem. But once it is compromised, nothing will keep paint on the bait for very long. I should rethink that last idea based on your experience.