GB GONE Posted June 3, 2011 Report Share Posted June 3, 2011 (edited) Well, after years of using every different plastisol out there, I finally cooked some that was as close to perfect as I have seen. It does have all the characteristics needed for hand pourers and hand injectors alike. I tested medium. The "herdness" of my resulting baits was between that of M-F's medium and LC's 502, closer to M-F. Great for swims and flipping baits but not to tough. Even big worms were really good. I fished all the baits already and can confirm the action. This is NOT an advertisement or any deal to get anyone to buy anything as I tested the plastisol the week before last and could have posted results then. I also was not the only person to test, just one of many that ended up getting samples for testing. Here were my results sent back to the distributor: 8oz cup of medium plastisol: Heat time (in microwave on high, 1100 watt): 2minutes 8 seconds. Color: colorless Clarity: no bubbles, extremely clear Fumes/smoke: very little fumes or smoke Resulting baits have a "dry" vs oily or slimmy feel. Baits were "set-up" within minutes or before removed from molds. Appeared to be a very slight soft packing that was mixed by very light rotation of jug. No remnants of packing on jug bottom after 3 complete rotations. I am not sure if the distributor is completely ready to start selling but I have word that about 2 weeks out. I do not have any idea of costs yet as well. Believe me, I have asked plenty of times!!!!! I post this to give hope to others hope that there is a plastisol that can work without the stirring, scraping, special cooking etc. Jim PS If anyone else on the forum tested this plastisol, please post up your impressions as I have no idea how other results were. I would like to hear from others that may have tested the soft version. Edited June 3, 2011 by ghostbaits Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bass100 Posted June 3, 2011 Report Share Posted June 3, 2011 Does this plastic float or is it neutral bouyant? Did you try it in a pot at all or just the microwave? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GB GONE Posted June 3, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 3, 2011 Does this plastic float or is it neutral bouyant? Did you try it in a pot at all or just the microwave? I tested the medium in my presto pot and my microwave. I did not have a lot of sample but I used the plastic in my pot (after heating it from raw in the pot) after 15 minutes and I did not notice yellowing in the resulting baits. The resulting baits did float (I did not add any glitter or salt to these baits). I can post pictures of the baits I made if anyone is interested. Just for the sake of noting the spectacular clarity of the baits. As a matter of fact, I can post a picture in the gallery of clear baits made with M-F, Lureworks, LC and this new stuff if desired. This would just show the clarity of the bait vs others. Jim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Boy Baits Posted June 3, 2011 Report Share Posted June 3, 2011 What is the name of this awesome-sounding Plastisol? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GB GONE Posted June 3, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 3, 2011 What is the name of this awesome-sounding Plastisol? Caney Creek Crystal Clear Plastisol Jim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deerak Posted June 4, 2011 Report Share Posted June 4, 2011 Caney Creek Crystal Clear Plastisol Jim It is on his website at $49.99 gal. Pretty spendy but if it is better than others, I will give it a shot. I am using Calhoun's and it is pretty stinky stuff and has quite a bit of small bubbles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wnybassman Posted June 4, 2011 Report Share Posted June 4, 2011 It is on his website at $49.99 gal. Pretty spendy but if it is better than others, I will give it a shot. I am using Calhoun's and it is pretty stinky stuff and has quite a bit of small bubbles. I believe it also said free shipping. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TTDuckman Posted June 4, 2011 Report Share Posted June 4, 2011 At $250 for 5 gallons, even shipped, that is about $100-125 every other brand shipped. Unless he starts selling this in larger quantiities with a bigger break, regardless of how good it is, he will have a rough time. There are some fantastic plastics out there for $120-150 shipped for 5 gallons. Tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caneycreekmolds Posted June 5, 2011 Report Share Posted June 5, 2011 At $250 for 5 gallons, even shipped, that is about $100-125 every other brand shipped. Unless he starts selling this in larger quantiities with a bigger break, regardless of how good it is, he will have a rough time. There are some fantastic plastics out there for $120-150 shipped for 5 gallons. Tim Hi Tim, The same question was asked on our site. Here is the response: It is absolutely coming out in larger sizes that will cost less (larger quantity = less labor, the packaging is hardly any different, but the shipping goes up). With that said, I think we will be very competitive and will continue to look for ways to reduce cost. This first batch to the masses is really more of a final validation vs. the official launch of the plastic. That's the main reason it's being offered in 1 gallon sizes. It's enough plastic someone can truly evaluate it and decide before they jump out and purchase 5 - 10 gallons. It's kind of the same principal we use with sample baits. We want you to be happy, and if your not, it's in both our interest to find out for as little as possible, as soon as possible. Hopefully that makes sense. I don't want to seem secretive, but once it's officially launched I think it will be apparent the extent we have gone to - to make it competitive with other plastics on the market. It won't be the cheapest, but in most cases I don't think it will be the most expensive either. Thanks, Jason Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daveh Posted June 5, 2011 Report Share Posted June 5, 2011 will stick with lc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bass100 Posted June 5, 2011 Report Share Posted June 5, 2011 As a business owner it would be foolish to put time into a plastic and not know how much it costs in bulk, but I am curious to see the final cost and hear the results. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carolinamike Posted June 5, 2011 Report Share Posted June 5, 2011 At the gallon price that's $2750 for a drum. Ouch! At these prices, shipping should be free. I used LC for years, yes and it's a good plastisol and I did some saltwater baits for a customer using MF plastic, but it was nasty. The fumes were absolutely terrible and the baits were sticky until left hanging overnight, and LC has always had a hard pack problem. And plus considering that both of these companies are pretty well middlemen you will never get a decent price. But this is over $1000 more than other companies out there by the gallon price, plus with the other company you're getting a price break for larger quantities bought. I personally don't like dealing with middlemen, most of them have to double the price that they actually pay per pound for plastic and if you have a problem, then you usually have to wait while they contact the manufacturer. To order a drum of plastic from a plastic manufacturer, you could probably get is shipped to you for between $900 and $1000. Then if you add $200-$300 for shipping, that's still $1300-$1400 less per drum. For $1400 less, I believe I could work through any other problems I was having with any other plastic. And I have never been paid by a plastic company to speak for a product. After supplying hand pours that I made to tackle shops for 7 years and now making baits for a living, I have had every plastic company out there to send me samples that I didn't ask for. I've tried others, Calhoun's is inconsistent and tends to have more of a petroleum smell, Chemionics had more of a chemical smell but was kind of sticky when the baits came out of the mold and the fumes were not that pleasant although nowhere near as bad as MF's. And I had the same results with Marchem as I did with Chemionics. And the thing about it is, almost all the plastic companies out there actually copied 3G's formulas from years and years ago. To me it seems like the high price of middlemen is the main thing that holds hand pour people back from ever making any money. I have never met anyone that sells a lot of hand pour products that's ever actually got paid a profit on what they made plus get paid for their time. Middlemen just don't make sense to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Prager Posted June 5, 2011 Report Share Posted June 5, 2011 I wonder if at these prices the baits are poured, bagged and maybe even drop shipped. I wonder if this will drive the price of scraps up? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GB GONE Posted June 5, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 5, 2011 Current price of LC gallon (from website) $60.50 + shipping around $17 = $77.50 Current price of M-F gallon (from website) $68.50 + shipping around $17 = $85.50 Both more than what the quoted cost was for the 1 gallon CC??!! I use them both currently so why wouldn't I want to use something that is less cost and far superior. Not sure everyone has gone around and looked at prices lately so there you go. If you extrapolate these out, see what you get for a drum???!!! Obviously there will be a cost break on the larger amounts or he will not sell any plastic. Give everyone credit, they shop around on price as well as quality. Bottom line to me is this, I no longer spend time (=money), stirring plastic everytime in need to cook, waiting for bubbles to dissapait (=money), or taking back packs of baits that have some weird chemical smell after several months (=money). This plastic is good enough to sel, itself for sure. Customers will love not smelling nasty plastic smell or a huge blast of garlic (to hide the weird smell of the resulting baits). I have yet to get a quote on larger amounts but have been told it will be extrmely close to what a 5 gallon of M-F, LC or Lureworks Ultrasol costs to your door. My last 5 gallons of LC was right at $164 to my door. If I can get this stuff for that much to my door, I'll buy in a seconds as I will spend time pouring, not mixing. Jim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GB GONE Posted June 5, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 5, 2011 I wonder if at these prices the baits are poured, bagged and maybe even drop shipped. If so, we all would have made plenty of money now as the others (LC, M-F) cost even more per gallon. They should have even paid for our molds Richard. And, we have been paying that for their plastic for years now. Everyone needs to go check the costs before attacking this offer. I understand most buy 5 gallons or more like I do. I just compared 1 gallon to 1 gallon prices though as that is apples to apples vs the apples to oranges everyone is doing now. I think if you haven't tried it, you should before knocking it. If it comes down to cost, everyone should be buying as this is almost 1/2 of M-F's cost/gallon and almost $30 less than LC's by the gallon. Jim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carolinamike Posted June 5, 2011 Report Share Posted June 5, 2011 Current price of LC gallon (from website) $60.50 + shipping around $17 = $77.50 Current price of M-F gallon (from website) $68.50 + shipping around $17 = $85.50 Both more than what the quoted cost was for the 1 gallon CC??!! I use them both currently so why wouldn't I want to use something that is less cost and far superior. Not sure everyone has gone around and looked at prices lately so there you go. If you extrapolate these out, see what you get for a drum???!!! Obviously there will be a cost break on the larger amounts or he will not sell any plastic. Give everyone credit, they shop around on price as well as quality. Bottom line to me is this, I no longer spend time (=money), stirring plastic everytime in need to cook, waiting for bubbles to dissapait (=money), or taking back packs of baits that have some weird chemical smell after several months (=money). This plastic is good enough to sel, itself for sure. Customers will love not smelling nasty plastic smell or a huge blast of garlic (to hide the weird smell of the resulting baits). I have yet to get a quote on larger amounts but have been told it will be extrmely close to what a 5 gallon of M-F, LC or Lureworks Ultrasol costs to your door. My last 5 gallons of LC was right at $164 to my door. If I can get this stuff for that much to my door, I'll buy in a seconds as I will spend time pouring, not mixing. Jim Jim, at $68.50 per gallon that's $3767.50 per drum without the price break and at $60.50 it's $3327.50 per drum without a price break. To save over $2000 per drum I just don't see how anyone could save that much money with their time and make any kind of profit at all, making and selling baits. In other words for $2000 less I think I could afford to give it a little bit of time. That's my problem with people like MF, LC and others, they have to double the price because they are a distributor and not a manufacturer, and let's be realistic here, if you get .10 to .15 for a plastic hand pour worm you're doing extremely well. It's bad enough that the retailers always try to keep the prices where you can't make any money doing hand pours, but for the component sellers to make it just as hard or harder, just really doesn't add up. And plus I"m sure CC's is just a re-distributed product and with the economy like it is, and plastisol not fluctuating anymore much, used to it went up and down, now it just goes up and stays there, I personally just couldn't justify paying twice the amount of money. I don't really understand what you were talking about the smell, as many runners as I've sold over the years, I have never once ever, had anybody complain about the smell, unless I had added it. And I've never, ever heard of a problem with bubbles in the runners. I just feel I'd rather reheat than fill someone else's pockets. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GB GONE Posted June 5, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 5, 2011 Mike: That is M-F's price per gallon on their site. A 55 gallon drum is not that much per their site. Whay can't everyone compare a 1 gallon cost to 1 gallon cost of the prices listed and wait until the guy puts out his prices. On the hand pours at .10 to .15 each, HUH???????????? I get near $1 each on some baits??? I don't have any idea where you get a price like that. Nobody only gets that price. Maybe I don't understand you. On the smell, I'd be glad to send you the resulting baits. They have a VERY STRONG smelling plastic like smell. Maybe it goes away after sometime but I also can't wait for weeks for the smell to go away. Time is money with anything but especially hand pouring. An extra 2-5 minutes per cup wastes hours per month and more per year. I'll do the math is needed to show the exact costs but have times the cups for bubbles and extra manipulation on heating. Again, I am not saying everyone needs to buy this. I was just reporting my results for the plastic. It is the best I have used in the microwave. The ability to just pour it out and not have to manipulate the plastic prior to using (scraping, mixing, etc) is a big bonus as well. Jim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GB GONE Posted June 5, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 5, 2011 PS More I read previous posts, more I think that some must think we are all morons or can't do simple math. If this plastisol is as expensive as you all have calculated (will be fun to revisit this when the actaul cost comes out), no one will buy it. Period. I think we all are very conscience of price and would just ignore the products that were to expensive. Gives us some credit for having the ability to think. Ya'll are acting like our goverment now! Jim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TTDuckman Posted June 5, 2011 Report Share Posted June 5, 2011 Jim, I have read your comments to this post. Jason answer my concern respectfully. The second you compare my concern with being like our federal government, all bets are off. Do not, under any circumstance compare me to the federal government. Jason's explanation worked for me and I will take him at his word. You should have left it at that, instead of questioning peoples motives (lest someone question yours), questioning our web surfing abilities, math skills, and comparing us to an organization that hasn't spent within its bounds for decades, nor has it produced a single item for sale on the retail market. Whe you started this thread, there was no frame of reference as to quantity pricing and it still merely a guess at this point. Something that you haven't figured out over all these years, is that you don't attack would be customers. As I stated, Jason was respectfull. Jason is also the owner and cares about his business more than anyone else, as it should be. You however, like the flavor of the month. You have not represented CCM well in this thread. If you are not a representative of CCM, it would be difficult for anyone to not believe so based on your responses, as you have represented yourself as such. Please don't compare me to the government. If you cannot represent CCM in a more positive light, you are likely doing a disservice to Jason. Tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GB GONE Posted June 5, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 5, 2011 Tim: Unlike others that post on this forum, I DO NOT represent anyone or anything. I do not represent CCM!!! If I did, I would have put the name of the plastic in the title and then on and on. I didn't mention the name until asked!!! I merely tested some plastisol as other did. I guess I was the only one willing to share my results. Sorry Tim, when I see misleading or attempted misleading info posted, I call it out. When I see posts "dumbing down" the issue, I call them out. I was clear from the beginning, I did not know any costs. I still don't. I have asked many times though as I am interested. Even if I knew costs, my purpose was to give the results of the plastic, not promote the sale. It was others that started with the comparative costs, none of which had any basis at all. There is loooong list of posts in this thread comparing this to that with costs. I am not an idiot and neither are the members here. I doubt that anyone that has a brain thought the costs would just be multiplied out, yet that was stated over and over again. Why? Because other do respresent other companies??? Don't know, don't care. Untrue though... Forgive me if I offended you as I did not direct that comment at an individual but merely the misleading information that was being spouted regarding costs. The assumptions made offend me! Again, I don't work for, represent or in any way receive anything from CCM. When I see good stuff, I talk about it. When it is sub par, I say that. Always have, always will. For what it is worth Tim, my "flavor of the month" is still M-F and LC plastisol. Been using them for all the years I have poured except the first. Used Clahoun's then. Go back and search the posts from many year's ago, I have always talked highly of M-F's virtue's. This plastisol is good stuff and I wish i would not have brought it to anyone's attention. Buy a gallon and test it yourself!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Or don't, I could care less. Jim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GB GONE Posted June 6, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 6, 2011 Well since I was appointed as the representative of CCM (promotion got me nothing more than my current corner office and company vehicle... LOL)... JK!!!! Seriously, that is a good point and there was no claim of consitency from me. I had one pint to test. Only time will tell on that point. I can only tell you what I tested and that is listed. The price for more than 1 gallon (and less than 1 gallon) has not been listed on their site yet. I guess we will see soon enough. I do know that this is not a Spike-It product but was developed by an independent chemical company. I was told that the litmus test was, will it perform in the microwave. No bubbles, low smoke, little yellowing and dry to touch baits when finished.The pots and machines are easy once the microwave is accomplished. They heat slower and easier. Time will tell as good products sell themselves. From reading the post in this thread, it seems Jason is using this 1 gallon start up to get the product out and let folks see what they think. Jim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GB GONE Posted June 6, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 6, 2011 Its got to be spike-it, chemenonics, mf of or at least one of the big names out there already.. Not just any company will prefab you one small batch at a time. I'm just a virgin here at TU...Please don't yell at me..Pow Pretty sensitive group of guys, those fishermen Pow.... It is not from any of those companies listed. I did ask that as I wasn't interested in a plastic I already had used. He took it to a checmical company and had them make a new product. You can look on his forum and I think he does say that somewhere in the topic of new plastic. Jim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GB GONE Posted June 6, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 6, 2011 Lol... Pow, I think guys were just trying to get a handle on what higher quantities will cost. Obviously extrapolating out the cost like that doesn't fly. I am sure we will see prices soon enough. Jim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caneycreekmolds Posted June 23, 2011 Report Share Posted June 23, 2011 Pricing, quantities and other details have been posted on our site. Release Information Thanks for your patience. Jason Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caneycreekmolds Posted June 23, 2011 Report Share Posted June 23, 2011 (edited) Wow what did we miss? The only question I have is how do you know it is consistent when it it’s only been for sale for a month or less. It is probably just a spike-its flavor. I see the gallon price how much is the 5'er with shipping? I live in Texas so shipping from MF and caney should be close to the same. Consistent would be with mf since they have been making the same product for 40 + years, with very few problems for me, any thoughts. Pow This is a great question. The true answer is only time will tell. With that said, we test every single mold we send out before it leaves our shop. Doing so has resulted in 2 returns in 18 months. We have the same process in place for the plastic. Prior to receiving the plastic we receive a sample of the batch. We test it prior to releasing the batch. Once we receive it we break it down and test it again. I can assure you of one thing, we are in the business of catching fish and making you happy. I am 110% not in business to pay shipping fees for returns, or have people upset. Does that mean we won't have a problem? It would be foolish to say we never will. However, we should never have a big problem. Does this additional testing add to the cost? No, it reduces the cost. It is infinitely cheaper for us to test the way we do than to incur the cost of returns and re-shipping. As a side note, MF is a great product and we carry it as well. Our plans are not changing to carry it as we move forward. Robert and Jeff are top notch! Jason Edited June 23, 2011 by caneycreekmolds Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
