archeryrob Posted March 17, 2012 Report Share Posted March 17, 2012 I borrowed by Buddys Badger air brush to make some lures. He only used it to paint a few decoys and really does not know how to use it so he can't help. I mix acrylic paint 1/2 and 1/2 or less and it seems good to paint. In the bottle it just will not come out until I thin it so much it runs trying to get the paint on it to cover and when it does come out it is very inconsistent. My buddy thought the straw for the bottle could be bad. So I use the cup you pour paint in and as soon as you push down on the air release it blows paint out of the cup. It's supposed to suck paint out of the cup. I can't even practice with this thing as it just will not work. I am just making a mess and wasting paint with this thing.Any advice? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bassguy Posted March 17, 2012 Report Share Posted March 17, 2012 It sounds as though the brush is really dirty. I would find some info on line about it as far as being able disassemble so it can be cleaned properly. If your friend knows nothing about it, I imagine he doesn't know how to clean it as well. Not being a smarta$$ but that's what it sounds like to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archeryrob Posted March 17, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 17, 2012 OK, how about cleaning instructions. Badgers instruction only involve cleaning with liquid after using or cleaning the tip. Is there more to clean? Do I need to totally disassemble it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archeryrob Posted March 17, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 17, 2012 I disassembled the tips over the needle and there is not any paint in there at all. None of the small holes are clogged. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayburnGuy Posted March 18, 2012 Report Share Posted March 18, 2012 If it's blowing air back into the bowl then you've got a clog somewhere. When cleaning an airbrush between colors, or at the end of a painting session, it's common practice to backflush by holding your finger over the end of the nozzle so it will blow air back toward the bowl to force gunk out of the nozzle. This sounds like the problem your having except your not having to hold your finger over the nozzle to force the air back into the airbrush. Try soaking the front of the brush (submerse everything from the bowl or suction tube forward) in lacquer thinner or acetone overnight. Pull the needle out before soaking so the thinner or acetone can get into the nozzle. This should loosen any gummed up paint. Then follow normal cleaning procedures. If that doesn't work get some Airbrush Restorer from Createx and give it another overnight soaking in the restorer. If it still won't clean up you will probably have to buy a new nozzle. Ben 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archeryrob Posted March 18, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 18, 2012 I messed with it some last evening. The blow back happens as the tip can be too tight. Now it might all be thinning ratio, but I am not sure. I am using cheaper acrylics as they always worked fine with a brush and epoxy coated. I am using paint like Apple Barrel and put it in the cup and adding some water. 1/2 and 1/2 seems to work and thinner almost seems transparent when you paint it. My Yellow this thin was running in drips and was transparent over the white. How many coats do you all have to make? I have watch people paint lures on video and they seem to do it in one coat, per color. Am I doing something wrong mixing it or something else? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archeryrob Posted March 18, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 18, 2012 Reading on the consistency of milk and that is where it was runny and transparent. Do you just do 3 or 4 light paint layers? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archeryrob Posted March 18, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 18, 2012 (edited) Rayburn, I think you are correct. I have the needle out and the tip all apart and soaking the entire brush in water right now. Then I will try scrubbing all I can with Pipe cleans later after it soaks. I was spaying without the tip and bubbling with it. I was not back flushing but was dropping the entire front into a bucket of water and blowing through without a paint cup to wash it all out. I saw that on a video. Maybe I should do something else? I guess you pull the needle before putting your finger over it. Edited March 18, 2012 by archeryrob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LimpNoodle Posted March 18, 2012 Report Share Posted March 18, 2012 Pipe cleaners can cause problems. Little bits of the fluff can clog a brush. Not to mention they're to large to clean most brushes. Go to Harbor Freight and buy some cleaning brushes for airbrushes. They cost about $1. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayburnGuy Posted March 18, 2012 Report Share Posted March 18, 2012 (edited) When you say "pull the needle" your not pulling the needle out of the brush are you? All you have to do is pull back on the trigger and hold your finger over the nozzle. And soaking the brush in water isn't going to clean any dried paint out of the nozzle. Only chemicals are going to do that. You will get better results by spraying multiple thin coats rather than one heavy coat of paint. It is also a lot easier, and more effective to heat set the paint when doing thin coats. If you spray heavy coats of paint and then try to dry it there is a possibility that it will form a skin of cured paint on the surface and leave damp, uncured paint under it. Not something you want to do. Ben Edited March 18, 2012 by RayburnGuy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crankbaitbilly Posted March 18, 2012 Report Share Posted March 18, 2012 check out www.howtoairbrush.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archeryrob Posted March 18, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 18, 2012 (edited) I will read the link, Thanks Crankbaitbilly. I tried thinning the bait with less than half windex to acrylic paint. and this is the result on a THIN coat of paint! I mean, as far as I have gotten over the past two days a paint brush is far simpler it just does not make the fade in and out lines. I am starting to wonder weather this is even worth the trouble! The picture is dark and that is not wood grain but running olive paint. It is still so thin it would need 4 costs to cover it. So, this stuff it so thin it does not cover with a brush, but if less than half thinned it runs when out on with an airbrush, thin. I have no idea, or I need other paint! I stopped with this and am back to old school brushes for now. This is by far the worst thing I have ever tried. I understand the learning curve, but this is like tying your shoes together and trying to run curve! I feel like a Dumb A$$ every time I mess with this thing and I engineer large security systems and networks for a living! Edited March 18, 2012 by archeryrob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archeryrob Posted March 18, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 18, 2012 I feel like an A-Hole right now. Watch this and everyone delight in my failure! http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2285829452014333467 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LimpNoodle Posted March 19, 2012 Report Share Posted March 19, 2012 Get some Createx paint and try that. I have a feeling you're thinning your paint too much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayburnGuy Posted March 19, 2012 Report Share Posted March 19, 2012 Why are you thinning the paint so much Rob? There is absolutely no reason to thin the paint that much. If your having to thin it that much to get it to spray then the airbrush is clogged up! Plain and simple. No amount of thinning is going to make up for an airbrush that is not performing the way it's designed to. Go to a hobby shop and buy a bottle of Createx like LimpNoodle suggested. If the Createx won't spray without thinning it then you have airbrush problems. And soaking the brush in water isn't going to fix anything. The only way to get the dried gunk out of an airbrush is to follow the steps given to you previously. Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crankpaint Posted March 19, 2012 Report Share Posted March 19, 2012 I will read the link, Thanks Crankbaitbilly. I tried thinning the bait with less than half windex to acrylic paint. and this is the result on a THIN coat of paint! I mean, as far as I have gotten over the past two days a paint brush is far simpler it just does not make the fade in and out lines. I am starting to wonder weather this is even worth the trouble! The picture is dark and that is not wood grain but running olive paint. It is still so thin it would need 4 costs to cover it. So, this stuff it so thin it does not cover with a brush, but if less than half thinned it runs when out on with an airbrush, thin. I have no idea, or I need other paint! I stopped with this and am back to old school brushes for now. This is by far the worst thing I have ever tried. I understand the learning curve, but this is like tying your shoes together and trying to run curve! I feel like a Dumb A$$ every time I mess with this thing and I engineer large security systems and networks for a living! if i read this post right your trying to thin with windex? your using the wrong thing to thin your paint you use windex to clean between colors not to thin the paint look up reducer on here for homemade reducer or buy some at the store,also if your using folkart paint from the craft store i reduce it 60/40 with distilled water and shake it really well then run it thru a paint strainer(you can get them at home depo,ace about any store that sells paint by the gal.)that gets rid of all the larger paint chips so it will shoot better thru the brush hope this helps Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archeryrob Posted March 19, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 19, 2012 Thanks, I will try a bottle of Createx and thinning a bottle of the Apple Barrel by removing 40% of the paint and thinning with water and straining it. I went back to the regular brush for a while so I can get some lures in the water the beginning of next month. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Musky Glenn Posted March 19, 2012 Report Share Posted March 19, 2012 Some Createx paints will spray without thinning. If it will spray through a spray gun, don't thin. I just use well water to thin with and only enough to get it to spray through my gun. It also looks like your strokes are across the lure the short distance. Try spraying the length of the lure and you won't have so many lap marks, that is usually where runs first occur. Try cutting your volumn down so less comes out at a time, that lets you control flow better. It would be good if you could actually see someone mix and spray in person. You tube has a bunch of good instructional videos on the air brush. Good luck and man it feels good when you figure it out. Musky Glenn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobP Posted March 19, 2012 Report Share Posted March 19, 2012 Rob, I also think you are thinning your paint too much. It should stick on the lure and form a coherent film. If you thin too much, it can't do that. Createx is formulated for airbrushes and may be thinned as much as 50% but that's not relevant to hobby paints like Apple Barrel. When I used Apple Barrel, I squirted it into the siphon cup of a Badger brush, squirted a small shot of water into the cup, and mixed it up with a swizzle stick. What was the percentage of thinning? As little as I could get away with, but never more than 25%. Hobby paints like Apple Barrel have large paint grains and no flow agents or extenders like airbrush paint. If you thin them too much, the grains tend to clog the airbrush and all that comes out is water, with the paint grains left behind to clog the brush. Soak the brush in lacquer thinner overnight, then shoot a cup or two of solvent through it to force out any old paint. Once acrylic paint has dried, water will not remove it. When you get the brush clean and the paint thinned correctly, you'll like the results and ease of use. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archeryrob Posted March 19, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 19, 2012 (edited) Well, I did not buy any Createx yet, but I took my medium blue for the Atom Striper Swipers and made a mark where 60% of the full bottle would be. I squirted what was left of the top 40% in to the trash can (not much) and filled to normal full. Shook the hell out of it and stirred it and I then blew a light coat. I can live with this! The sprayer did sputter a bit, but it painted. I will have to see it Createx does not sputter. Now with a thinned bottle I just squirt some out of the bottle into the cup, paint and when finished drain what is left back into the bottle and waste the gun and cup out. I can waste this cheap paint, but I was wasting time, sand paper and lots of BIN primer before every time I messed up. I still might buy some of the Createx to try. They just have some awesome colors and the lures there Striper guys make just can't be replicated with the dull tones of standard acrylic paints from Micheal's, unless some one has ideas. Thanks, I don't feel as "retarded" any more. But my friends disagree. Edited March 19, 2012 by archeryrob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayburnGuy Posted March 19, 2012 Report Share Posted March 19, 2012 If the airbrush is still sputtering it doesn't sound like you have addressed the main problem that is the cause of all your frustration. And that is a dirty airbrush. Until you get it properly cleaned you will not be able to see what an airbrush is truly capable of. It sounds like your much happier with it now and I'm glad you got it working, although in a diminished capacity. Imagine what you could do with it firing on all cylinders. One big difference in "craft" paints and "airbrush" paints is what Bob explained to you. Craft paints are usually more available and cheaper, but they are not really designed to be sprayed through an airbrush. The granulated pigments in craft paints are not ground as small as those in airbrush paints and will end up clogging your airbrush unless you use a fairly large nozzle. And by using a large nozzle your not going to get the full benefit of the airbrush. Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archeryrob Posted March 19, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 19, 2012 Thanks Ben, the little cap that slide over the needle under the tip had had some paint in it. Other than that it was clean. I will try some Createx and the only reason I have not is the $4.99 vs. $.99 price. I am a cheap date, don't you know! A little beer and my wife an make me do anything, .... like mow the yard! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayburnGuy Posted March 20, 2012 Report Share Posted March 20, 2012 LOL You are a cheap date. good luck, Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobP Posted March 20, 2012 Report Share Posted March 20, 2012 One thing we haven't addressed - at what pressure are you shooting your paint? With the hobby acrylics, I always had to use more air pressure to get them to shoot consistently - around 30 psi or more. If you keep airbrushing, you'll find the extra couple of bucks spent on airbrush paint is a good bargain, considering the hassles of hobby paints. That's especially true when you start shooting multiple colors. Get several colors on the lure, then your next color screws up everything with splatter or runs, ruining the whole job and making you start from scratch. Doesn't take many episodes like that to make you start using paint that sprays more consistently. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sonny.Barile Posted March 21, 2012 Report Share Posted March 21, 2012 (edited) Do not reduce a whole bottle or in the paints original bottle. I use apple barrel and Americana paints exclusively. I reduce with water I have stored in a 32 oz jar that has 1 drop of dawn dishwashing liquid dissolved in it. Get a plumbing strainer from Home Depot as stated previously. Use this to pour paint from the original bottle in to your airbrush bottle and thin in that bottle . I have found with craft paint that there is no specific formula for all of the colors, or even between bottles of the same color. Keep at it and you will get the hang of it. Lay off of the baits for a while and just practice thinning and painting using some scrap paper. Add a little water at a time until it is just right. Believe me you will get better. I am now at a point where I can spray glitter paints thru a $5 HB airbrush. Hope this helps. Edited March 21, 2012 by Sonny.Barile Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
