Q's About Building

[enzyme]

I've been looking for a rod with specs that are rarely offered by major brands, I can not find too many, as least not ones that are visually pleasing to me. I am beginning to entertain the idea of having somebody build one for me and have many questions about that.

- Would it be more or less cost-effective to have one custom built compared to one offered by a major brand? Assuming all parts are roughly equal in quality. Basically, is it worth it?

- How much will someone typically charge on top of the parts? Just the labor. (I probably won't have the time to learn the craft and picking up a new hobby will drive the lady mad lol)

Edited July 25, 2012 by enzyme

[Mattman]

There are no easy answers here and you'll likely get as many different answers as you do responses.

- Would it be more or less cost-effective to have one custom built compared to one offered by a major brand? Assuming all parts are roughly equal in quality.

In my opinion... If you buy $50 - $150 off the rack rods, no it wouldn't be cost effective. If you buy $400 - $500 off the rack rods, yes it would be cost effective.

Basically, is it worth it?

If you're looking for something you can't find off the rack, I do believe its worth it.

Quite honestly, the guys that request a rod identical to an off the rack rod, but with different wraps, drive me nuts. That's just a waste in my opinion. Getting a builder to build a rod exactly how you want is the reason to go to a custom builder. The handle the length you want, and not from a kit. The handle in the material you want. The seat you want. The guides you want. Etc.

- How much will someone typically charge on top of the parts? Just the labor.

Different builders have different pricing structures. Some guys triple the retail cost of materials. Some guys have a flat fee. Some guys, myself included, look at the project and assign times for every task and charge that way.

Very few of my rods are just simple assembly builds. I need to look at how much time I'm going to have from start to finish. Charging a flat fee just doesn't work for me.

Most of my builds use high end components. It is no more or less difficult to build on high end components versus low end. So why should I make more money just because I use high end? So I base using my cost of materials.

Your builders skill level will also play a big part in what you are charged. A new guy just starting out may charge next to nothing as they are chalking it all up to "education". A guy that's been building for 15 years and is in demand will probably charge you quite a bit more.

Expect to pay, on top of materials, $100. I wouldn't be shocked at $200. And, depending on how complex your build is, $400 isn't out of the realm.

Edited July 26, 2012 by Mattman

[enzyme]

Thanks Matt. Sighh, gosh there is a lot to think about here. I guess I really have to weigh the options some more. My concerns are on one hand I would love to get one custom built in detail to my every liking, on the other hand I don't know if I'd be going overboard with every specific detail.

To be honest regarding some specifications, I have not the experience to know what I'd want or is good enough and what is overkill. Reel seats as an example, I have 5-6 rods with different seats, some works more smoothly than others, some feels more comforable than others but they all work and none of them annoys or has broken on me. I guess if I am going to have one built there is no reason not to get anything but exceptional quality, if price is the biggest issue, I shouldn't even look at custom builds.

If I had a total budget of roughly $200 for everything, is that going to get me something pretty decent? The most I've ever spent on a rod is $150 (Crucial), I probably can't justify spending a whole lot more than $200.

[Mattman]

If I had a total budget of roughly $200 for everything, is that going to get me something pretty decent?

In my opinion...No.

There will be probably close to $60 - $70 in freight alone for components to a builder and the rod to you. Long tubes don't ship cheaply. There went a third of your budget.

An Avid blank (middle of the road quality/performance) is going to be around $100. Or, if your builder buys, and charges you wholesale, about $75. That leaves $55 to buy guides, seat, grips, and miscellaneous materials. How much do you make per hour at your job? Multiply that by the 6 to 10 hours of labor it will take to build your rod. And add that to the materials total.

Everyone is different and some guys are happy with a $60 rod and some guys need to have a $500 NRX or an $800 Megabass. I feel you need to be closer to the $300 mark to start seeing good gains. At $200 I feel you need to compromise on materials too much and you're better off buying a nicer off the rack rod for the same kind of money.

On the high end builds I do...

$200 for a rod blank...$80 for a set of guides...$35 for a painted reel seat...$5 per INCH for cork...$150 for decorative bling items...12+ hours of labor.

[Musky Glenn]

I second Mattman, that was a very good reply.

Enzyme- Don't rule out building one on your own. There is nothing like fishing with a hand built rod. Watch the videos on You Tube, take one of your own good quality rods that you can do without for a while. Strip it down and rebuild it in your spare time. You can reuse the same eyes, make notes of the spacing of the eyes. Try the EVA foam grips (great for winter time fishing) and don't remove the reel seat. Buy a few spools of colorful thread and give it a go. Very cheap way to see what it is all about. Don't worry about having all the tools that they may show on the videos. I still pull my thread through a book for tension. Don't do it when you are tired and expect to make mistakes that you will need to correct. Like taking an eye off and turning it around the other way. Been there done that. First thing I would do is take a rod and just wrap thread to see how you start and stop the thread, that will give you an idea of what you are getting into. Musky Glenn

Edited July 30, 2012 by Musky Glenn

[ezsmith]

I will build any rod based on this scale parts + $5 per single wraped guide, 7 for double wraped and 10 for tripplewraped guidel. 20 kit charges covers glue and epoxy ect and then shipping cross wrappes are estimated basted on wrap as well as custom cork... there are some other options but those are discused between builder and client. I have build about 180 rods this year and some rods for big name people like some of the cast of wicked tuna some pro bass anglers and what not plus majority of the money i make goes back in to my charity that builds custom rods for wounded vetrans check out my site at warriorrods.org and contact me there.

[Ggeorge]

Some logic to the question of whether or not to custom build.

 

These days almost everything is on the rack somewhere however if you are after a genuine top quality rod the cost is about the same. Most high end brands are not built production style so are often similar in layout and quality to custom stuff. Ugly Sticks for example are spun fast and furious on production lines in China or similar while Sage flyrods are built one at a time on a one man rod lathe start to finish by at most a couple guys. Usually a guide wrap guy and a handle maker. Production stuff doesn't see that sort of attention.

 

I know that just prior to Loomis becoming a Shimano holding most of their rods were built by actual rod builders in a production environment. I suspect that anything coming from offshore is no receiving that attention these days.

 

I believe St Croix rods are built much like those Loomis rods here in North America or a furthest for the cheap stuff Mexico.

 

If you really want something unique don't shy from the initial cost. An example; twenty years ago I built myself a 13 foot Loomis IM6 float rod for steelhead fishing. Cost then about $300.00 in parts, best of the best in the day. As recently as last year I was offered twice my original expense.

 

That rod has caught literally thousands of steelhead and other trout. I used it nearly every day for a couple years and most weekends for a decade or so. I broke the upper half once and had it replaced at cost (partial warranty).

 

I can't say for sure what compares to that Loomis quality of the eighties and nineties but if you can find that kind of quality and warranty combined with a competent builder you won't regret it.

 

I built dozens of rods for myself and many more than that for friends, taught a few guys how to build rods and custom tweaked a bunch of stuff that was broken or past it's best before date over the years. I'm an ordinary builder at best but all my stuff is still intact and working better than most rack rods I ever owned.

 

You get what you pay for, always. If it seems cheaper it almost always actually is. Sometimes you luck out the rest of the time you buy the luck that I had with that float rod. No regrets, not for sale. It's a lifetime rod.