MuskieBait Posted February 16, 2013 Report Share Posted February 16, 2013 I have watched the tutorials on here and a couple others on Youtube about mixing POP. All the videos say 2 parts POP to 1 part water. I just tried mixing 2 cups of water to 4 cups of POP and the mixture was nearly as runny as plain water, even after 3 min of stirring. Then I kept adding POP and all of a sudden it set up and I had basically ruined 3 pounds of POP. Is there a different ratio I should be mixing at? I am trying to make a mold of a 9" long, 2" high bait if that makes any difference Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
basskat Posted February 17, 2013 Report Share Posted February 17, 2013 I just add water until it looks right. Just keep adding it untill it's about the thickness you want and pour in the mold. I would advise a little on the wet side to give you time to get your master set in place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MuskieBait Posted February 17, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 17, 2013 Once it has "set" and you like how it is, do you then let it continue to air dry or do you bake the mold? Also is there a company I can send some soft plastic baits to and they can make me some molds that I could pour into? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
basskat Posted February 17, 2013 Report Share Posted February 17, 2013 I let it air dry until I can safely take it out of the mold. Then bake it for about three or four hours in an oven at 250 degrees. Leave the oven door cracked so the moisture can escape. There's several places that will cut a mold for you. Check with Caney Creel plastics, they can do it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ipt Posted February 17, 2013 Report Share Posted February 17, 2013 start with water, add pop to it until you can see "islands" of it just under the water, then it should be perfect. if its too runny, just keep stiring it for a minute and it will turn thicker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slammingjack Posted February 17, 2013 Report Share Posted February 17, 2013 I made like three molds with pop and then I tried DWP. One part water, three parts DWP comes out right most of the time. IMP makes a better mold. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MuskieBait Posted February 17, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 17, 2013 Do I bake the mold with the mod podge applied or bake it and then add the mod podge? Slammingjack, what is DWP? Thanks for all the help guys!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dink Master Posted February 17, 2013 Report Share Posted February 17, 2013 Durham's Water Putty Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dink Master Posted February 17, 2013 Report Share Posted February 17, 2013 Durham's Water Putty Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bflp Posted February 18, 2013 Report Share Posted February 18, 2013 2:1 ratio is what I use for my POP molds. They usually end up on the thick side and I need to add a little additional water. When I'm mixing the POP, I always think it is thinner than it really is. It pours much thicker than it mixes, if that makes sense. Maybe you had the right mixture and it just looked too thin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wchilton Posted February 18, 2013 Report Share Posted February 18, 2013 MuskieBait, Something doesn't seem to add up. From what you described, using 4 cups plaster and 2 cups water, I would have expected your mixture to be too thick. I always go by WEIGHT and mix 70 parts water to 100 parts plaster...so 2 lbs plaster would be mixed into 1.4 lbs water. The best way to mix is by adding the plaster to the water slowly, usually "sifting" it into the water. When you do this, it will seem like there isn't going to be enough water to cover the plaster but it will be just enough when you finish adding plaster. The plaster will not start setting up until it is stirred, so once plaster has been added to water give it a little time to "soak" and the plaster will release air bubbles and get wetted throughout. After a few minutes of soaking, stir gently until it is fully mixed. Some people use their hands for this (with rubber gloves) because you can feel when the plaster is mixed to a smooth consistency. Do not let the plaster set on your hands, it heats up fast and can burn you. After mixing, tap the sides of the container (or drop it a few inches) several times to get air bubbles out and then pour. Right after mixing, the plaster should be like thick liquid. As it sets, it goes through a "plastic" phase that is similar to pudding (thick but can still be moved around) and then from there to hardened/solid (but still kind of soft) and will get very hard over the course of 30 min to an hour. When hard, it still has water in it (like a sponge) and needs to be fully dried. If you bake it (heat it up) to make it dry faster, just keep it to 250 deg F or lower. Above about 300 deg F the plaster can start to weaken. I'd suggest mixing a small amount just to observe how it behaves through the soak, mix, plastic, hardening phases. I use an inexpensive postal scale (digital) with a 30 lb capacity By the way, if you somehow got ahold of some type of "gypsum cement" rather than plaster, that may explain your problem with the mixture. If so, you'll have to look up the mixture ratio...gypsum cements use a lot less water than plasters. It would be the same process for mixing, just using less water. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
basskat Posted February 18, 2013 Report Share Posted February 18, 2013 I would recommend something besides Mod Podge to coat your mold. It wears off way to fast. I normally use Devcon epoxy. There's several other things that yo can use, some of the other guys can jump in on that. Dry the mold before coating. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MuskieBait Posted February 18, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 18, 2013 Thanks for the info guys. I did manage to make one mold. I ended up using 3.5 cups of water and 5.5 cups of plaster. It stirred really well and was a pretty good consistency when I was satisfied all the bubbles and clumps were out. I let it harden for an hour before i Unscrewed my mold box and removed my "template". Did a little trimming with the x-acto and it is now in the oven at 225, with the door cracked. I still found the POP mixing odd. Yesterday I mixed 2 cups water, and 4 cups plaster and it ended up being totally runny. Today's 3.5 cups of water should have taken 7 cups of plaster, but only needed 5.5. The only difference is yesterday's plaster was in the smaller 4.4lb cartons and i just gave up today and bought the 25lb bag. I am certain by the time I get to the largest 2 baits I want to make I will be mixing plaster in a washtub so I will use the 25lbs. basskat. I am familliar with Devcon. Do you use the 5 minute epoxy? Do I need to re-bake the mold after using the epoxy or Mod Podge. When you say the mod podge wears off...what happend when it does? Will that ruin my mold when I pour into it, or will my bait just come out with a matte finish? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ipt Posted February 18, 2013 Report Share Posted February 18, 2013 3.5 cups of water to 5.5 cups of pop? thats a ton of pop, what are the dimensions of your mold? i use mod podge, glossy. 50/50 with water. takes a few coats but it makes my pop nice and shiny. and its extremely easy and clean to work with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rixon529 Posted February 18, 2013 Report Share Posted February 18, 2013 I've never used it, but I've read on this forum that the Mod Podge will weaken and actually peel out of the mold after a while. I guess it doesn't bond with the PoP as well as other products. I've successfully used the 30 minute Devcon epoxy. 30 minutes is a good time frame to ensure complete coverage with one coat at a time. Elmer's Glue All or Elmer's Carpenter glue mixed with water in a 50/50 ratio is also popular and effective. Both the Devcon and Elmer's are usually applied in two or three coats for a good seal. Rick SE CT Shoreline Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MuskieBait Posted February 18, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 18, 2013 my mold, which is for the smallest of the 3 baits I will be making, is 9 inches long, 5 inches wide, and 2.5 inches deep. the final and biggest mold will be nearly 16 inches long, 6-7 inches wide, and 4 inches deep. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
basskat Posted February 18, 2013 Report Share Posted February 18, 2013 I use the 30 minute Devcon. You get a nice glossy finish and it last forever. If you have lots of fine details it can cover these up if applied to thick. Don't use heat to cure it, after your final coat let it sit a day and you're ready to pour. Sounds as if your pouring a monster bait. It's going to take the plastic a while to cool down enough to remove from your mold. When you finally get it poured I'd love to see a picture. Most of my baits are smaller but do pour a few swimbaits and 13" worms. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodkaman Posted February 19, 2013 Report Share Posted February 19, 2013 I just checked my records; last time I did any PoP work, I used 5:4 PoP/water ratio by volume. I sprinkle in the powder by hand and mix with my bare fingers. I use a moisturizing cream after I am done. Keep notes and do a test mix with any new batch of PoP. It is all practise and experience. Note - PoP ages and becomes unusable. If your mix seems too lumpy, gritty and have problems setting, then it is probably past its sell by date. Fresh PoP makes such a difference. I did a lot of experiments about drying PoP but cannot find the files. Over drying in the oven can ruin the mold, as once all the water has evaporated, the mold starts to increase in temperature. Once the mold passes a particular temperature, it starts to change composition and will become powdery on the surface. As the casting dries it loses weight. You can monitor this with a simple kitchen scales. When the weight loss stops, you are done. You only have to do this once and make a note of the time. After a few goes, you will be able to pick up a mold and tell whether it is dry or not, again, it is just experience. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MuskieBait Posted February 19, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 19, 2013 How do I go about using the Devcon...squirt some out onto waxed paper and paint it on with a paintbrush? Should I use devcon for the mold cavity and modpodge for the rest of the mold? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
basskat Posted February 19, 2013 Report Share Posted February 19, 2013 I paint mine on with a brush. You could use Mod Podge for the rest of the mold. I coat the whole top side with Devcon. Normally don't coat anything but the top. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MuskieBait Posted February 19, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 19, 2013 Does POP ever become rock hard? I baked mine last night at 200-225 for about 2 hrs. It still had steam coming off of it when i took it out. It is really solid now, but i can still scratch it with my fingernail. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wchilton Posted February 19, 2013 Report Share Posted February 19, 2013 It doesn't get rock hard. The more water you use the more porous/soft it will turn out. Max hardness would be if you had zero excess water but then it would be too thick to pick up small details and would be very difficult to thoroughly mix. I've seen some on-line tutorials where people add elmer's glue to the water to create a more plastic-like result but haven't tried that myself. Your surface treatment (sealing) will help with the hardness of the surface and I'd go with the 30 minute epoxy in your case. With a mold as thick as you are making, it's going to take a while to dry out. Don't try to rush it, I've had molds crack when I did that. You might want to try just leaving a fan blowing over it. When it's completely "dry" it won't steam or feel damp at all and will also be a bit lighter in weight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MuskieBait Posted February 19, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 19, 2013 I put the last mold in a small room in the house and turned on a space heater. That seems to have helped a bunch. I just poured another mold. 14 cups of water and 20-22 cups of plaster. I am going to let it set for 75 min before I unscrew the mold box....wish me luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
basskat Posted February 19, 2013 Report Share Posted February 19, 2013 That's some big molds! Makes my 14" worm molds look small. Good luck! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MuskieBait Posted February 19, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 19, 2013 The biggest one, I am afraid, I will be mixing in a large rubbermaid container. Do you think 75 min is enough dry time before i take it out of the mold box?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
