bluetickhound Posted May 16, 2013 Report Share Posted May 16, 2013 Like others here, i love the finish DN gives but I don't build in sufficient quantity to justify using it any more... I have tried many of the products metioned here (with the notable exception of solarez) and have pretty much settled on either D2T or more often, ACC.... The ACC really has worked out well for me as I prefer to dip lures (hence my initial attraction to DN!!) and the ACC can be used with far less waste than the DN. My ACC topped lures have proven to be durable and extemely glossy (some folks don't care for gloss finish... I personally love it...) and I haven't had any issues with yellowing whatsoever in the year or so that I have been using it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobP Posted May 16, 2013 Report Share Posted May 16, 2013 OK, I'm ignorant. What exactly is ACC? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluetickhound Posted May 16, 2013 Report Share Posted May 16, 2013 Amazing clear cast. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saltshaker Posted May 17, 2013 Report Share Posted May 17, 2013 OK, I'm only gonna say this once.....KBS Diamond Finish. Bassnbrad turned me onto it and it's the best I've used. I use it as a topcoat over Etex on my foiled lures. Clear as gin and rock hard. Dip 'em 'n' ship 'em with very few storage issues. http://www.kbs-coatings.com/diamondfinish-clearcoat.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayburnGuy Posted May 17, 2013 Report Share Posted May 17, 2013 with very few storage issues. http://www.kbs-coatings.com/diamondfinish-clearcoat.html Care to elaborate on those storage issues? Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saltshaker Posted May 17, 2013 Report Share Posted May 17, 2013 Care to elaborate on those storage issues? Ben Ben, I'm now using my second quart of KBS. I didn't have any problems with the first quart stiffening up until 6 weeks or so of using it 3-4 times per week. Brad told me to thin it about 20% and it did just fine. I didn't thin it until it started getting stiff. After coating you can dip again as soon as the previous coat tacks off. I've used Devcon and hated it. It's a PITA when you're trying to do 10-12 lures at a time. I still use Etex on my foiled lures, but, I dip it twice in KBS for the final clear. Works great mixing glitter with it, too....gotta brush it, tho. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobP Posted May 18, 2013 Report Share Posted May 18, 2013 A couple of questions. I read the info on the KBS site but couldn't find a MSDS sheet on the Diamond Finish. According to the site, it continues to harden for several weeks. That's true for many urethanes but do you know whether it may be a moisture cured urethane? I like the info saying that it contains 60% solids, which is a hallmark of good auto urethanes. But most of them require mixing with an activator containing isocyanates, which are highly toxic. That brings me back to the MSDS and user precautions, which are not extensively discussed on the site. What do you thin your KBS with? The site mentions a proprietary thinner they sell. One of the users mentioned thinning it with xylene. Bottom line, it sounds promising but there are a couple of niggling questions I have before springing $60 for a quart. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluetickhound Posted May 20, 2013 Report Share Posted May 20, 2013 (edited) I had pretty much given up on my DN.... I have a mason jar that has some in it that I know has skinned over about a half inch thick. Is the DN underneath any good or should I just trash the jar? I have a lure I'm considering dipping but it has turned out reaaly nicely and I'd hate to screw it up at the end of the game... Like others have said, I love the finish i get with DN, but because of the hassles associated with it I have moved towards my tried and true ACC and to a lesser extent, D2T.... Edited May 20, 2013 by bluetickhound Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcori3 Posted May 20, 2013 Author Report Share Posted May 20, 2013 Open it up and skim off the cured stuff and if what is underneath is still good then dip. That's what I did. I was in the same boat as you and it worked ok for me. I have since moved onto another sealer as well. One that I can dip but doesn't have storage issues. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobP Posted May 20, 2013 Report Share Posted May 20, 2013 The DN under the skin is still usable. But it's hard to remove the skin without leaving chunks that will mess up the finish if you still want to dip lures in it. I use a spoon or a cheap syringe to get the still-liquid DN out of the jar and brush it on. When I use nothing or Bloxygen and a skin forms, it is very hard and I have to break it with a hammer and chisel. I recently tried using aerosol wine preserver instead of Bloxygen and a soft skin formed quickly, which is easy to penetrate but it also negates dipping lures. Bloxygen is nitrogen/argon. Wine preserver is argon/CO2. It's cheaper than Bloxygen but if you dip lures, it's not a good solution IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluetickhound Posted May 20, 2013 Report Share Posted May 20, 2013 I have been using Bloxygen and the skin is hard but doesn't adhere to the mason jar so I can get an X-Acto knife between the jar and the meniscus of the DN to get it out. I'll use a popsicle stick stirrer to see how "clumpy" the DN is and see if I feel safe to dip this lure....if it's good to go I'll trash the remainder after this one is done but the lure has turned out such that I want just a very thin, yet durable topcoat to finish it, which lets out the ACC and the D2T.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Krash7172 Posted May 23, 2013 Report Share Posted May 23, 2013 My wine perserver is Argon/Nitrogen/CO2. I opened the can for the first time after it was empty and there is absolutely no hardened DN at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobv Posted May 24, 2013 Report Share Posted May 24, 2013 I quit pouring into a second container for storage and started using the tap the can method. I can use the whole qt. without any hardening in the can. I just pour out what I want to use and reseal the can with the self tapping screw. I had to start brushing it on but with the right brush and method it's as quick and easy as dipping. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcori3 Posted May 24, 2013 Author Report Share Posted May 24, 2013 Bobv are you using the Bloxygen as well? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobv Posted May 25, 2013 Report Share Posted May 25, 2013 Bobv are you using the Bloxygen as well? No, I have some but I don't want to crack open the DN can to spray it in. I used to dip and I did use Blox. but I was pouring it into other containers. The jars would always start to skin over at some point but the stuff in the can never would. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcori3 Posted May 25, 2013 Author Report Share Posted May 25, 2013 Bobv, I have only gotten one can of it so far. I poured the whole thing into a new mason jar. Bought the bloxygen and after i dipped i would spray some in holding the lid just cracked enough to get the straw in. I liked the dipping method, and its a great product. If i get another can i will definately never open it and just tap the can. And i will brush it on and hang. I dont crank out a lot of lures like a lot of guys do so i dont mind brushing it on. I just didnt like the waste of so much dn that occured for me. I have been using that as3000 sealer that is for concrete design and so far i like it. Dries faster and super glossy. I usually do two coats and let it cure real good. Have gone out and fished my cranks and it seems to be holding up great. I still use d2t when i do glitter on a bait so i can just mix it in when i stir my epoxy. D2t is great as well. Im thinking of trying the solarez maybe and see how that does. Im always into trying different things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j27 Posted May 25, 2013 Report Share Posted May 25, 2013 How much time are you guys getting once you pour DN before it starts to get tacky or how many lures can you brush? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobP Posted May 25, 2013 Report Share Posted May 25, 2013 I get around 8-9 months dipping lures from 2 jars preserved with Bloxygen. If you brush and use the can tapping method of dispensing DN, it may last until it is all gone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j27 Posted May 25, 2013 Report Share Posted May 25, 2013 Thanks, I should have worded my question a little better. I was wanting to know how much brushing time per session after you pour some out and how many baits ( 2 to 3 inches) can be done before it gets unusable. I just got some DN and solarez this week. I tapped the can and poured some in the bottom of a soda can and I barely got through the second bait. Is this normal? ( I can normaly get 5 or so with e-tex.)If so, then I need to pour less out. If not, the only other possible explanation is that I didn't clean the bottom of the can good enough. I did use that cup for solarez just before I poured DN and thought I cleaned it well enough. It's possible there was some kind of reaction, maybe? I also didn't like the finish on a bait I did with solarez so I cured it well ( about an hour or so in the sun ) then tried DN on top of the cured solarezed bait, that was catastrophic. Will not try that again. Thanks for your help! John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pilg0r Posted May 26, 2013 Report Share Posted May 26, 2013 I thinking about starting to paint my own Crankbaits. I wanna dip my lures instead of using epoxy, but dealing with storage issues would suck. I came up with this idea. Add an o-ring on the threads for a tight seal. Pump the air out. Close valve. Would this prevent materials such as DN from getting a skim or hardening? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayburnGuy Posted May 26, 2013 Report Share Posted May 26, 2013 I thinking about starting to paint my own Crankbaits. I wanna dip my lures instead of using epoxy, but dealing with storage issues would suck. I came up with this idea. Add an o-ring on the threads for a tight seal. Pump the air out. Close valve. Would this prevent materials such as DN from getting a skim or hardening? Even if you could achieve a 100% vacuum, which is pretty much impossible, you are still exposing the DN to moisture in the air while you are transferring it from the shipping container to your vacuum jar. And every time you opened the jar to use the DN you'd be exposing it to moisture. Keep in mind that it only has to be exposed to moisture once to start the curing process. The "tap the can" method" is the only way I've heard of anyone being able to use 100% of the DN without any loss. Unfortunately this method does not work for those who like to dip their lures. Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Krash7172 Posted May 27, 2013 Report Share Posted May 27, 2013 Something like this might work for frequent users. Tap the can. Leave out the top screw. Cover with a plastic bag full of bloxygen. http://i171.photobucket.com/albums/u305/Krash7172/misc/20130526_115956_resized.jpg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayburnGuy Posted May 27, 2013 Report Share Posted May 27, 2013 Before everyone starts getting confused about "tapping the can" the original "tap the can" method uses only one screw located in the side of the can at the bottom. Capt. Sully was the one who first told me about it quite some time ago. I'm not saying these alternate methods don't work as I haven't tried them. We get new members all the time and I felt like this method might need a little clarification. It's easy enough for newcomers to get confused with the flood of information on this site without having to figure out which one of half a dozen different methods to use and all of them going by the same name. I'm not trying to discourage anyone from improving on any process, but maybe we should include in our explanation that something is a variant of another process instead of calling them all by the same name. just my , Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobv Posted May 27, 2013 Report Share Posted May 27, 2013 One screw is all I use. Give the can a light squeeze if it stops pouring. I have poured out enough to brush a dozen lures without any problems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hazmail Posted May 27, 2013 Report Share Posted May 27, 2013 Krash--I like it, that's pretty close to the "Wine Box" idea -- try "3M", they make a product pretty close to this, all you need is a solvent proof tap. Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
