bluetickhound Posted May 31, 2013 Report Share Posted May 31, 2013 I had a lure yesterday that had been dipped and the finish started lifting.... Of course that wouldn't do so I waited for the topcoat to dry and got out my exacto knife to begin removing the finish.... What happened was something of a surprise.... My process is to dip twice in polyacrylic (sanding with 400 grit in between dips), sand lightly again then twice in the prop before beginning the paint process.... The delamination occured between the prop and the polyacrylic. Should I be using 220 grit? Only dip once in the prop? This is most distressing because now I wonder if all my baits finishes are not truly adhered to the sealer coat.... I had experienced blistering after leaving a lure or two in a hot (as in heat hot... Not stolen....) car last summer but my solution to that has been to not leave lures in hot cars.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A-Mac Posted May 31, 2013 Report Share Posted May 31, 2013 I would skip the sealer if you are using prop. Same deal though, after the first dip do a light sand to knock of the burs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayburnGuy Posted May 31, 2013 Report Share Posted May 31, 2013 I would skip the sealer if you are using prop. Same deal though, after the first dip do a light sand to knock of the burs. X2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobP Posted May 31, 2013 Report Share Posted May 31, 2013 X3. I use multiple coats of prop but not over another coating. I'd choose one undercoating and do multiple coats of it. After 6-8 dips in prop, I think it needs a hardening period of 12-24 hrs to become really hard and expel all of its acetone. Haven't used polyacrylic sealer, but maybe it would work as well as prop as an undercoating since it will be covered with water based paint. But I hesitate to put a solvent based coating between 2 water based coatings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluetickhound Posted May 31, 2013 Author Report Share Posted May 31, 2013 Thanks for the advice guys! I tried just using prop but since I work with balsa i got a lot of bubbles due to off gassing.... I'll try just doing polyacrylic with my next few lures. I had wondered if i was overdoing it since the topcoat seems to seal everything pretty well.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A-Mac Posted May 31, 2013 Report Share Posted May 31, 2013 I'm surprised you were getting bubbles in the prop. I normally have 2 solutions of prop made up. One is thinner, which I use for the first coat or two, then I follow up with a slightly thicker coat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluetickhound Posted May 31, 2013 Author Report Share Posted May 31, 2013 I'm surprised you were getting bubbles in the prop. I normally have 2 solutions of prop made up. One is thinner, which I use for the first coat or two, then I follow up with a slightly thicker coat. When I first started using prop I did it exactly like that.... My balsa comes from Hobbly Lobby and is on the soft side so I imagine it has a good bit of air inside so when I dip it bubbles began escaping almost immediately. When (on Nathan's advice) i started using polyacrylic it solved my bubble problem but now I'm seeing that i have adhesion issues... All part of the process.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nathan Posted May 31, 2013 Report Share Posted May 31, 2013 That is weird...I've never had a Issue.....is this the only bait this has happened to?...Nathan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A-Mac Posted May 31, 2013 Report Share Posted May 31, 2013 When I first started using prop I did it exactly like that.... My balsa comes from Hobbly Lobby and is on the soft side so I imagine it has a good bit of air inside so when I dip it bubbles began escaping almost immediately. When (on Nathan's advice) i started using polyacrylic it solved my bubble problem but now I'm seeing that i have adhesion issues... All part of the process.... Ahh. I've never used the polyacrylic before. Heck, if (when) I go back to balsa again I will probably try the Solarez clear on it. I still have my prop and it provided a nice finish, but I wanted something clearer (I never could achieve the glass clear, despite reading everything on here about prop). I think humidity was just too much of a factor. I wanted it for coating over foil before painting primarily. Anyway, this just goes to show there is more than one way to skin a cat... and every way is messy! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluetickhound Posted May 31, 2013 Author Report Share Posted May 31, 2013 (edited) That is weird...I've never had a Issue.....is this the only bait this has happened to?...NathanAs far as I know. I am kinda wondering if the sudden heatup we've experienced here in Atlanta has anything to do with it... Or if it's just that my polyacrylic was too slick when I went to the prop... Or possibly I didn't give the prop enough time to set up... 24 hours should have been sufficient but then again, it has been mighty humid around here lately.... The polyacrylic put a dead stop to bubbles in the prop, that's for sure! By the by.... I still have a ton of prop pellets (probably around 8 or nine pounds of 'em!) so if anyone needs any, shoot me a PM and let me know... Edited May 31, 2013 by bluetickhound Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diemai Posted May 31, 2013 Report Share Posted May 31, 2013 After my experiences propionate does adhere to sheer timber ONLY ! Tried it on linseedoil-treated and woodsealer-treated blanks before , ...also dipped blanks with glued in wire forms , ...could peel off the cured propionate of the treated blanks and the glue portions afterwards . I now soak my sheer blanks in a thinner mix of prop for 48 hours for deep penetration , afterwards I'd dip them into a thicker mix for 6-8 times ,sand smooth inbetween first dips to clear out bubbles , .......afterwards I sand and prime , paint and topcoat ! greetz , diemai Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluetickhound Posted May 31, 2013 Author Report Share Posted May 31, 2013 Thanks Dieter! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diemai Posted June 1, 2013 Report Share Posted June 1, 2013 Thanks Dieter!Forgot to mention , ......after the 48 hrs soak I'd sligtly sand down the rosen woodgrain , ....disadvantage is ,that after the 6-8 dips one would have to clear lipslots , belly slots and pilot hole from cured propionate to fit in all parts again(or one furnishes these after dipping entirely ???) , ....I do not mind this added effort , since I know , that this way even the interiors of the lure receive a little protection and sealing , no hazzles when trimming the blank with ballast in a waterbucket .Greetz , Dieter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobP Posted June 2, 2013 Report Share Posted June 2, 2013 When you dip balsa in prop, the bubbles are from the prop penetrating the wood. Most of them burst if the solution is thin enough and those that don't will usually disappear with the next dip. When all the pores in the balsa are filled with dried prop, bubbles cease. I use 7-9 dips of thin prop. If I see any bubbles after the 3rd dip, I'll give the prop a very light sanding with 400 grit and then continue. There's no agreed-on formula for prop solution, but I find thinner is better. I like mine to be just slightly thicker than water. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldtoolsniper Posted July 18, 2013 Report Share Posted July 18, 2013 Look at this site for more information. You are looking for the "Chemical Resistance" chart. They tested these pellets against a lot of strange things not likely found in a tackle box. This information should help identify or at least narrow down what reacts with this type of product. It looks like plastisol (rubber worms I think) dissolves it. Interesting reading. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark poulson Posted July 18, 2013 Report Share Posted July 18, 2013 I'm guessing the solvent in your prop softened the outer surface of the polyacrylic sealer, so there was no real bond. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
