aydensdad82 Posted March 11, 2014 Report Share Posted March 11, 2014 (edited) Has anyone used a router to shape the top and belly of flatside cranks? I sand my edges to get them round but i am interested in using a router to get more consistency and more of a "u" shape. My concern is a router seems overkill for 2"-3" bass lures. I saw dremel makes a small hobby style table, anybody tried that? Thanks guys Edited March 11, 2014 by aydensdad82 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kajay920 Posted March 11, 2014 Report Share Posted March 11, 2014 Some of the muskie lure makers use a router on their big lures. I wouldn't want to rout something so small as a 2"-3" lure though. I have routed small components over the years for various wood working projects and it is horribly nerve racking. A general rule of thumb is to keep your fingers 3"-4" away from the blade so unless you build a jig of some sort that is pretty impossible with such a small lure. I once made a jig for some small footballs where I put some non skid fabric on the end of a 2x2 and tried to use it as a mobile hold down. It was very wobbly and I had a hard time holding the work piece up to the fence and pilot bearing. Then as the piece got more round it became even harder to hold flat. Good luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aydensdad82 Posted March 11, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 11, 2014 Some of the muskie lure makers use a router on their big lures. I wouldn't want to rout something so small as a 2"-3" lure though. I have routed small components over the years for various wood working projects and it is horribly nerve racking. A general rule of thumb is to keep your fingers 3"-4" away from the blade so unless you build a jig of some sort that is pretty impossible with such a small lure. I once made a jig for some small footballs where I put some non skid fabric on the end of a 2x2 and tried to use it as a mobile hold down. It was very wobbly and I had a hard time holding the work piece up to the fence and pilot bearing. Then as the piece got more round it became even harder to hold flat. Good luck. Yeah that was my concern. I like having 10 fingers. I am thinking the dremel router may be the ticket for this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayburnGuy Posted March 11, 2014 Report Share Posted March 11, 2014 Gene and Vic (Lincoya and littleriver) have posted topics about using routers to cut out blanks. They have made jigs to hold the blank that keep your fingers away from the router. The jig consists of a master that is attached to a handle and the blank to be cut is then aattached to the master using double sided tape if I remember correctly. Could be wrong about that part. After the blank is affixed to the master it is then run through the router using a flush cutting bit. Do a search and you can probably find what I'm talking about. They also have made jigs to consistently cut out diving lips using pretty much the same process. Ben 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aydensdad82 Posted March 11, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 11, 2014 Thanks Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayburnGuy Posted March 11, 2014 Report Share Posted March 11, 2014 My pleasure. I don't remember exactly where the posts are, but if you can't find them with a search you might try sending Gene or Vic a message. I'm sure either of them would be glad to help. Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aydensdad82 Posted March 12, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 12, 2014 My pleasure. I don't remember exactly where the posts are, but if you can't find them with a search you might try sending Gene or Vic a message. I'm sure either of them would be glad to help. Ben I found them. Pretty interesting and looks like a solution. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobP Posted March 12, 2014 Report Share Posted March 12, 2014 I think you'll be disappointed with the Dremel router table and with trying to use their router bits for rounding baits. There are no Dremel router bits that have a large enough cut diameter to do any significant rounding over. The ones available are small (1/8"?) for light duty work. Their routing table is mostly plastic and it doesn't seem designed for precision cutting. I love my Dremel and use it extensively in building baits but the router accessory just didn't cut it for me. One neat idea I've seen for rounding over baits is to use pulley wheels mounted on a bench grinder with sandpaper glued inside the pulley's grooves to determine the bait's rounding profile. Might scuff up a finger if you aren't careful but it won't take one off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pat28 Posted March 12, 2014 Report Share Posted March 12, 2014 I got myself a pneumatic sander. It is like a large rotary tool but it can sand a hole through a piece of wood in no time, and is a safe tool to use (well, as safe as a tool can be). It provides great control to the user. Not the consistency of a router, but speed, a great finish and the chance to keep your ten fingers. Pat 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aydensdad82 Posted March 12, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 12, 2014 I will have to checkout the pneumatic sander. Thanks Pat. Bob my concern with CNC routers is price. That would have been my solution if funds were available. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pat28 Posted March 12, 2014 Report Share Posted March 12, 2014 Look up Kirjes sander online. A great all-around tool. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobP Posted March 12, 2014 Report Share Posted March 12, 2014 I looked at the Kirjes sander and it seems similar to the Foredom tool I got a couple of years ago - which is basically a more powerful Dremel type rotary tool that accepts bits up to 1/4" shank diameter and employs a flexible shaft and hand piece. I have a 1" diameter 4" long soft rubber sanding drum on the Foredom that makes quick work of shaping-sanding tasks but for smaller crankbaits, I still use a smaller Dremel sander because it offers a bit more hand control. One nice feature on the Foredom is you can run the tool in forward or reverse and vary the speed via a foot control switch, so you can shoot the sawdust plume it creates away from you. I'm thinking what Aydensdad82 is looking for is a tool or jig that rounds both sides of a lure simultaneously to a defined profile. You have 2 choices - either a cutting tool or a sanding tool. I would prefer sanding because it's safer unless you have a method of holding a small crankbait securely away from your fingers while cutting. That said, I still do it by hand with a Murphy knife to cut facets on the shoulder of the lure and a rotary sander to blend the facets smoothly into the body shape. You can get a nice symmetrical body this way IF you measure and mark the facets before you start cutting. I use a drafting compass to do that. It ends up being a lot of detail work to mark, cut, and sand the body shape but I just consider it part of the work needed to make a good crankbait with the tools I have available. If I built more than a hundred crankbaits a year, I'd be looking for faster, more exact methods. Since it's a hobby, that would only spur me to make even MORE crankbaits than the surplus already crammed into 10 plastic 3700 boxes in the garage - the shame of a crankbait building habit! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aydensdad82 Posted March 12, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 12, 2014 I looked at the Kirjes sander and it seems similar to the Foredom tool I got a couple of years ago - which is basically a more powerful Dremel type rotary tool that accepts bits up to 1/4" shank diameter and employs a flexible shaft and hand piece. I have a 1" diameter 4" long soft rubber sanding drum on the Foredom that makes quick work of shaping-sanding tasks but for smaller crankbaits, I still use a smaller Dremel sander because it offers a bit more hand control. One nice feature on the Foredom is you can run the tool in forward or reverse and vary the speed via a foot control switch, so you can shoot the sawdust plume it creates away from you. I'm thinking what Aydensdad82 is looking for is a tool or jig that rounds both sides of a lure simultaneously to a defined profile. You have 2 choices - either a cutting tool or a sanding tool. I would prefer sanding because it's safer unless you have a method of holding a small crankbait securely away from your fingers while cutting. That said, I still do it by hand with a Murphy knife to cut facets on the shoulder of the lure and a rotary sander to blend the facets smoothly into the body shape. You can get a nice symmetrical body this way IF you measure and mark the facets before you start cutting. I use a drafting compass to do that. It ends up being a lot of detail work to mark, cut, and sand the body shape but I just consider it part of the work needed to make a good crankbait with the tools I have available. If I built more than a hundred crankbaits a year, I'd be looking for faster, more exact methods. Since it's a hobby, that would only spur me to make even MORE crankbaits than the surplus already crammed into 10 plastic 3700 boxes in the garage - the shame of a crankbait building habit! LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VanderLaan Posted March 13, 2014 Report Share Posted March 13, 2014 When I was carving decoys, I used a bow sander to round over heads and bodies. Pretty simple to make and quite effective. You would need a vice to hold the lure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLT785 Posted March 13, 2014 Report Share Posted March 13, 2014 Take a look at this site: http://www.copycarver.com 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barr5150 Posted March 13, 2014 Report Share Posted March 13, 2014 If it helps, this is my setup. Basically just a old $10 garage sale router mounted to the underside of my workbench. I put a small piece of lexan over the top so the lure bodies slide easy. The key was the router bit. I think I paid around $25 for the bit I'm using now as opposed to the $5 bit I started with. The quality bits cut much nicer and don't want to grab the wood as easy. If you use a similar setup make sure you note the cross hatched area I marked in the pic. That represents the only usable side of the router bit. Get much outside of that and you be searching for the lure body! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aydensdad82 Posted March 13, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 13, 2014 Ah thank you Barr. Vander, and SLT. So Barr you still have 10 fingers? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barr5150 Posted March 13, 2014 Report Share Posted March 13, 2014 HaHa! So far yes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark poulson Posted March 13, 2014 Report Share Posted March 13, 2014 You can make a sanding block with the curve you want, and use that to give yourself a controllable, safe shaping device. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aydensdad82 Posted March 13, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 13, 2014 You can make a sanding block with the curve you want, and use that to give yourself a controllable, safe shaping device. That is actually what I am doing now and it works fine, just looking for alternatives. When I use the sanding block I tend to veer off to the sides. My wrists and fingers lock up on me which doesn't help when I am trying to be precise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark poulson Posted March 13, 2014 Report Share Posted March 13, 2014 If you only a few sizes of cranks, you might try making a U shaped block, with a flat in the middle of the U with no sand paper, and curves on both sides. That way the block would stay centered, more or less. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aydensdad82 Posted March 13, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 13, 2014 If you only a few sizes of cranks, you might try making a U shaped block, with a flat in the middle of the U with no sand paper, and curves on both sides. That way the block would stay centered, more or less. You mean the flat in the middle should keep contact with the flat on top of my lure? Only have sandpaper in the true curve of the block so that wood is never sanded off the top or sides, just edges? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonister Posted March 14, 2014 Report Share Posted March 14, 2014 What is the big danger behind using a router? I have been considering using one myself but wasn't sure if it would be worth the risk, if there is one. I have been hearing some stuff about loosing fingers and such and wouldn't like that to happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kajay920 Posted March 14, 2014 Report Share Posted March 14, 2014 On 3/14/2014 at 12:16 AM, jonister said: What is the big danger behind using a router? I have been considering using one myself but wasn't sure if it would be worth the risk, if there is one. I have been hearing some stuff about loosing fingers and such and wouldn't like that to happen. jonister, Used improperly the router can be a very dangerous tool. Its bits often moving at around 28,000 rpm. When you form materiel on a router you are shoving a piece of wood into the bit that is moving toward you. If that wood is not absolutely control some violent actions can occur. If insufficient downward pressure is not maintained the work-piece will vibrate and lift off of the spinning bit and if you hand is still moving toward the blade... gotcha. If the work-piece is pushed into the bit in the wrong direction, the bit will grab the work-piece and launch it violently into whatever direction it is pointed. The standard rule of thumb that I've been taught and used is to keep your fingers 3"-4" away from the bit as you are moving toward the bit. If you have a small crankbait that is only 3" long that you have to both push into the fence or bearing AND hold down at the same time maintaining that safe distance is quite impossible with out some sort of jig to hold the work-piece for you. Now, you need to use something that is stable enough to still control the movement and pressure. A pair of simple push sticks like used on a table saw will easily slip and potentially be jammed into the spinning bit. (Insetr violent reaction here). You could use a push pad like those for a joiner. That will most likely cover up the entire work-piece and you are working blind. Also, if the bearing on the router bit is too tall it will hit your push pad and not your work-piece. The shaft of the bit above the bearing is still a moving piece and could catch on the padded part of the push pad. (Insert violent reaction here) Don't get me wrong, as stated above, I have occasionally routed small pieces of wood. Your fingers cramp up and you have to go slow. Not very good for production runs. Below is a link to a video that shows just what a router can do to a finger that gets too close. ***Warning**** it is very graphic! https://youtu.be/cgNCFojZZJw Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kajay920 Posted March 14, 2014 Report Share Posted March 14, 2014 google router accidents on You tube Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
