Deep Running Crankbaits

[Skeeter]

I have two questions:

 

1).  If you are going to bust the 10 ft. barrier when cranking, what crankbait that you currently own would you use?

 

2).  What would be your choice of rod, reel, and line to throw it?

 

Skeeter

[Jaw]

Strikeking 5or6 XD ten pound stren 7ft quantum crankbait rod 5:4 lews speed spool

[BobP]

Lots of crankbaits qualify and I have lots of crankbaits.  In the fall, my favorite is a  small 1/4 oz Luhr Jensen Hotlips Express that will dive to 12'.   I build deep divers and use them but among commercial cranks, I most often use Rapala DT16's in the summertime.  Equipment:  7 1/2' custom St. Croix M power saltwater popping blank, with a 6.2:1 Shimano Scorpion or an old 6:1 Abu Pro Max reel and 10 lb copolymer line.

[RayburnGuy]

I'm going "old school" since I don't get to fish as much as I once did and haven't really updated most of my equipment in 10 years or more. That being said I've probably caught more of my big fish (over 8 lbs.) on a Norman DLN than everything else put together. While it may, or may not, reach exactly 10 feet it will get really close to that depth one way or the other. I usually fished it on a 7' 6" G. Loomis medium heavy rod with any of several Abu Garcia reels and 12 lb. P-Line mono. No fluorocarbon line was available for bass fishing back then. I liked any of the older 5500 Abu's as they had a larger spool than a lot of today's reels. The reason I liked the larger spooled reels was that they had to revolve fewer times to put out the same amount of line as a reel with a smaller spool. This translated into longer casts for a given number of spool revolutions. I even keep a 6500C Abu for my deeper cranks and sometimes use Fireline on it if I needed every inch of added depth.

 

hope this helps,

 

Ben

[woodieb8]

troll just kiddin guys

[RayburnGuy]

troll just kiddin guys

 

trollin' trollin' trollin'..............keep those cranks a rollin'

 

Sung to the tune of "Rawhide" 

 

Awww come on now. You guys know you were thinking the same thing.

 

Ben

[Musky Glenn]

RayburnGuy x 2, I even have a couple of those round abu's with the 3.8 to 1 best reel for heavy cranking I ever used.

[Nathan]

Ben,

I had CCR's tune.."Rollin down the river " tune going through my head!!!...lol..Nathan

[RayburnGuy]

Ben,

I had CCR's tune.."Rollin down the river " tune going through my head!!!...lol..Nathan

 

 

That will work too Nate. Wonder if any of the younger guys have a clue as to what we're talking about.

[woodieb8]

remember the 9-a bomber I know they troll to 32ft casting should get down. I know a guy that's got boxes new. there not built now

[HAWGFAN]

A Strike King Series 5 (not the XD) will get you 12', so that's a good place to start.  This is where cranks start to pull fairly hard.  I'm with some of the other guys on reels.  When the load starts to become significant, I break out the round bodies.  I have a Quantum Iron and an Abu 4600C3 that are in the 6:1 range.  When I need even slower for DD22's and XD's, I like my old Abu 5000.

[Nathan]

Ben,

They just think we are just a couple babbling senior citizens!!..lol

[flipper2]

I like the Poe's 400 on 10# Pline with my 20 year old Lew's or 5.1 Quantum energy.  However, my new goal in life is to build some Tapp style baits that will run at that depth. I absolutely  love the look and feel of that bait!

[sonoman]

Norman DD 16, 12 LB flourocarbon, custom built MHX 7'6" CB905 CB 907 blanks coupled with the latest Shimano Curados....works exceptionally well.

[Tracy G]

That will work too Nate. Wonder if any of the younger guys have a clue as to what we're talking about.

I do. Lol.

[riverotter]

i like my Calcutta when throwing dd22. its almost 20 years old and still as good as new. on the inside anyway the outside I a lil rough.

[jonister]

If you want deep, a Luhr Jensen Hotlips Express way way way back behind the boat trolled with light line will get you about 20 ft down there. casting them is great too. where I live the smallmouth love em. (light line, 12- 15 pound test)

Edited August 26, 2014 by jonister

[Skeeter]

OK.... one of the things that I noticed here is that most of you that answered  only mentioned store bought crankbaits. With all of the talk that is done on this forum about making a better crankbait, nobody mentioned their own lure or even someone elses custom made crankbait. Most of the posts in this forum now days seems to focus only on shallow running crankbaits. I mean......doesn't anyone here make deep running crankbaits and throw their own stuff? Also, there was no mention of anyone buying a custom crankbait? So what is the deal? Do you feel that you gain nothing with buying a custom crank? Are they too expensive? Could it be that the day of making deep custom crankbaits by hand is just a waste of time?

 

Skeeter

[BobP]

I make a few deep divers including one that goes 20+ ft.  The local lake I fish is very deep so even the deepest diver can't get me down to 30 ft or deeper where the bass often hold.  My typical winter spoon fish are 55 ft deep.  Do I fish my own cranks?  Yep.  But I have to say that a really good deep diver with good action is the most difficult type of crankbait to make.  You have the reputation of doing that, and kudos to you!  Custom crankbaits is a business that is always swimming upstream.  The offerings of commercial deep divers have expanded in the last 5 years and the bass fishing public tends to follow the lead of pro anglers using sponsors' baits.  Plus guys have discovered that there are alternative deep baits - soft swimbaits on bullet jig heads, heavy jigs, flutter spoons, bladed jigs, hair jigs, etc.  Fishing technology and bait fads never really stand still.

 

I don't think deep cranking is a dying art - But ,I think its popularity has declined a bit after peaking a year or two ago.  It is very popular on Tennessee River lakes where ledge fishing is the norm in summer.  But its popularity has forced many pros to switch to alternatives to catch bass that are now highly educated.  The BassMaster Bass Fest on Chicamauga Lake TN was a case in point.  Of course, this is just observations of an old man sitting in his recliner all summer watching BassMaster and FLW TV!

Edited August 27, 2014 by BobP

[CarverGLX]

OK.... one of the things that I noticed here is that most of you that answered  only mentioned store bought crankbaits. With all of the talk that is done on this forum about making a better crankbait, nobody mentioned their own lure or even someone elses custom made crankbait. Doesn't anyone make a deep running crankbait? Doesn't anyone throw their own stuff? Doesn't anyone buy custom crankbaits? Is the day of making deep custom crankbaits just a waste of time?

 

Skeeter

I think it has headed in that direction because you asked what everyone uses to go deep. Not many build the deep baits because they are just harder to do in general. I have made TAPPs that will run 10ft but haven't attempted anything that goes deeper... It's coming though.

As far as semi-custom there are Brian's Bees and older Lohr's lures floating around that will bust that mark easily.

As for question #2 about the setup... Breaking 10 feet isn't that big of a feat with about any setup and the right lure. 20 feet is a whole different ballgame. To achieve max depth you need to make the longest cast you can, with the deepest running lure, and the smallest diameter line. That means use the longest rod (usually 8' max in tournaments), longest casting reel, and small diameter fluorocarbon you can safely get away with.

Superlines are of course smaller than fluoro but float negating depth. Fireline is nearly neutral in buoyancy. Fluoro sinks.

When building a lure for this I would avoid balsa. It simply doesn't have the durability needed. Not to say it can't or hasn't been done but there are better choices for this paticular application. The amount of weight needed for ballast and the position of weighting needed will make the lure more awkward to cast than a heavier material.... Unless you can create a weight transfer system.

Production baits that have this system allow you to cast farther which is basically the name of the game when achieving depth. Combine this with the cost difference of production and custom lures and it is easy to understand why they are more popular.

Is it a waste of time? Of course not. This is what we do. Custom and homemade baits do catch fish and at times out fish production baits. In this particular instance though the advantage may be less, the work more, and the demand for condistsncy lure to lure higher.

[HAWGFAN]

I have been experimenting with making deeper diving balsa baits.  I have a few configurations that I'm pleased with that reliably reach 8 to 12 feet.  My latest attempt will probably approach 15 feet, and still has a decent amount of action.  I'm not sure if I'll ever try to go much deeper.  I prefer my baits to maintain a fair amount of buoyancy.  They are much easier to get free of snags, and are more lively when they deflect off of cover.  To gain much more depth, I'll have to sacrifice that characteristic.  If I'm going to build a bait that begins to act more like a plastic one, I'll just buy factory baits, but that's just me.  Deep cranking isn't exactly my deal, so it's not like I have invested in a huge collection of these type baits.  I will say that is has been an interesting process to make deeper diving balsa baits.  If anyone has never tried it, you should.  I'm with CarverGLX, in that balsa isn't necessarily the best choice for getting the most depth.  I'm not sure if durability is my greatest concern, but other materials would probably be easier to ballast.

[sonoman]

OK.... one of the things that I noticed here is that most of you that answered  only mentioned store bought crankbaits. With all of the talk that is done on this forum about making a better crankbait, nobody mentioned their own lure or even someone elses custom made crankbait. Most of the posts in this forum now days seems to focus only on shallow running crankbaits. I mean......doesn't anyone here make deep running crankbaits and throw their own stuff? Also, there was no mention of anyone buying a custom crankbait? So what is the deal? Do you feel that you gain nothing with buying a custom crank? Are they too expensive? Could it be that the day of making deep custom crankbaits by hand is just a waste of time?

 

Skeeter

I  personally only make topwaters from scratch and a few glider type baits for seatrout and redfish, all of mine factory baits are pretty much custom painted by myself but living where i do...shallow water for the most part here in central Florida I  havent even thought to build one....do you have a website Skeeter?...I tend to prefer guys who build the whole deal start to finish, like Rob does there at jawjacker but thats just me, apparently theres a lot of guys making a few buckss painting the KO's...

[BobP]

"The amount of weight needed for ballast and the position of weighting needed will make the lure more awkward to cast than a heavier material.... Unless you can create a weight transfer system.  Production baits that have this system allow you to cast farther which is basically the name of the game when achieving depth. Combine this with the cost difference of production and custom lures and it is easy to understand why they are more popular.  Is it a waste of time? Of course not. This is what we do.  Custom and homemade baits do catch fish and at times out fish production baits. In this particular instance though the advantage may be less, the work more, and the demand for consistency lure to lure higher."

 

I think CarverGLX nailed it as far as the practicalities go.

[diemai]

"The amount of weight needed for ballast and the position of weighting needed will make the lure more awkward to cast than a heavier material.... Unless you can create a weight transfer system.  Production baits that have this system allow you to cast farther which is basically the name of the game when achieving depth. Combine this with the cost difference of production and custom lures and it is easy to understand why they are more popular.  Is it a waste of time? Of course not. This is what we do.  Custom and homemade baits do catch fish and at times out fish production baits. In this particular instance though the advantage may be less, the work more, and the demand for consistency lure to lure higher."

 

I think CarverGLX nailed it as far as the practicalities go.

I guess , I'd have to , at least partly , disagree , ........at least if you'd be ready to leave the typical short and fat-bodied crankbait shape behind , guess that you call it an "Alphabet Lure" ?

 

Some years ago I had started to carve deep diving lures after Australian samples , .....these basically have an elongated and curved body and a very large and wide , forward pointing  lip , .....their wobble is very strong and vigorous , ......the more curved their body , the more strong the wobble , and the lest curved the body the deeper the dive , ..at least as a rule of thumb .

 

I'd make these deep divers either from very buoyant PU hardfoam material or abachewood , also quite a buoyant timber(though not quite as light as balsa) .

 

Already with my first versions of such Aussie lure versions I've found , that the big lip would let an unweighted blank float up pretty much nose heavy , but due to the buoyant material there would be still enough room for ballast .

 

This ballast would be placed into the rear part of the belly , just down the tail end , in order to render the blank to float up level or at least only a tad nose heavy .

 

Now this rear ballast not only makes up for the swim level , but also causes the lure to cast extremely well , also the big lip would act like some kind of a rudder or a stabilizing fin on flight allowing the lure to dart straight forward generating the smallest air resistance possible , ......most often such lure would level itsself belly up on flight , almost gliding through the air until impact on the water's surface , .......off course the elongated , curved body also does it's share to level the lure .

 

But I've found out , that only a thin and light lip material would be essential to achieve this feature , ......made similar lures equipped with lips of 1,0mm aluminium and also 1,5mm Lexan , ....the Lexan lipped lures performed much better in terms of casting distance and stability on flight , .......only logical , since more ballast can be placed into the rear , if mounting a lighter lip .

 

OK , ....but the most important question remains , .......would such lures have an appeal on your local American bass ?

 

In Australia they catch local predators similar to perch , zander(walleye) or bass , ..that's what they are designed for , ....but for over here in Germany I've found , that local northern pike do not seem to be attracted by such lures too much , maybe they are just too lively in swimming action , .....but surely our local European perch(very similar to your Yellowbelly perch in the US) are .

 

For you to figure out about these Aussie lure versions of mine , ...here are links to my gallery :

 

http://www.tackleunderground.com/community/index.php?/gallery/image/9843-chalk-painted-deep-diver/

 

http://www.tackleunderground.com/community/index.php?/gallery/image/9844-mottled-finishes/

 

http://www.tackleunderground.com/community/index.php?/gallery/image/10152-latest-pvc-grubs/

 

Maybe worth a shot for American bass , .....dunno , ........at least these lures cast very well and can be made to run very deep(that lip size in my gallery picture never is the  final size limit , I suppose) .

 

Just my   , .....good luck , diemai

[mark poulson]

Dieter,

I can't believe that a pike wouldn't attack that Aussie deep diver, especially if you paint it in a yellow perch scheme.

I'd hit it!!!