s4il Posted January 25, 2015 Report Share Posted January 25, 2015 Going to keep it to the point from start to finish, ****Critiques are welcome!**** Devcon 30 min. Is what im using. Step #1 Prep clean surface bottom of soda can with D. alcohol & wipe Off stamp/colored dot from MFG, Let air dry. #2 Pour Equal amounts of resin/harder into Small plactic ___ml___ marked cups to get equal amounts correct #3 Using a Wooden Popsicle stick, i scrape each cup on sides/bottom well and pour into the well of the Soda can, at this stage nothing is mixed yet. #4 After epoxy has settled i start mixing with Popsicle stick, rotation in circles, While mixing i notice the epoxy has started to change colors, goes from clear colored, to more of a White Milky look, with few bubbles, i use a straw and blow the bubbles out. #5 Add ONE small drop of D. alcohol into the mixed epoxy, than continue mixing total timed mixed all together about 3-5 minutes. #6 Room temp is at 70-72, Humidity is steady at 20% (have a digital humidity/temp gauge) #7 Using cheap plastic colored brushes i apply epoxy working my way Around the bait, first couple pick ups of epoxy go VERY SMOOTH, everything Looks great, after about 2-3 minutes the epoxy starts getting thicker, almost like cool maple syrup, surly not what i started with, cloudy patches are showing **ONLY** in Natural sun light, cant really see them in room light, the bait looks great in room light, but under out door sunlight its almost as if you see these patches of cloudy streaks under an initial clear coat, the epoxy Levels out even, all sides look good, i have no dimples or area's which i missed. #8 Place lure on turner, in the same room temp i started with, with the same 20% humidity. what am i doing wrong? I use E-tex on my top water baits, same method above, and those baits come out like GLASS, so transparent, but i heard Devcon is better for baits which make contact with rocks, more durable, so i like that feature. anyone use e-Tex on cranks, and have any durability issues? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpalinsk Posted January 25, 2015 Report Share Posted January 25, 2015 Hmmm, I haven't run into that issue DevCon. I mix mine directly in the cleaned can bottom but I'm using the syringe type dispenser. I mix for about 30 seconds then add a few drops of DA (varies by amount of epoxy) and mix it up another 30 seconds. I then gently exhale over the expoxy several times reduce air bubbles and then apply with an artists quality type brush and place on my lure turner. (All recommendations I got from this site.) Mixing the expoxy for 3-5 minutes seems excessive to me and I think it would cut into the amount of time you have to coat your lures. I never tried so I could be wrong. Is there a reason why you don't just mix the epoxy in the plastic cups? Transferring to the soda can bottom sounds like an extra step that may be decreasing the working time of the epoxy. I'm buying some Bob Smith epoxy and plan on using graduated plastic cups to measure and mix and then throw away. FYI, Using my method, I can just barley get two 4" lipless cranks top coated and I work fairly quickly. HTH, David Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jign4bass Posted January 25, 2015 Report Share Posted January 25, 2015 I've heard that they are starting to add "chalk" to the epoxy now. That may be where it's coming from. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
s4il Posted January 25, 2015 Author Report Share Posted January 25, 2015 (edited) About the plastic cups, i was using those, but i noticed some of the inside wax coating coming off into the clear coat, i got the cups from a food vendor, i ruined a few baits using those cups, so i now instead us the soda can as my base mixing area, as far as the mL cups using those to mix in, im afraid those as well have the wax coating, you know the cups sometimes are Completely transparent, and others are kinda a clear plastic with a hint of White film inside them, ya i got those kind, so im sure they are also lined with wax, ill try mixing LESS and applying faster and see how that goes, at first i was under the impression that the D. alcohol was the cause of the streaks. ***UPDATE*** I am using the Devcon HOME 30m epoxy, thanks for that above Jig, i read the article posted here, and looked aat the Box.... that package does say "May contain chalk pigment" MOTHER FLOWER! SON OF A BISCUIT *&!@#()&%(!@&(!@#* Edited January 25, 2015 by s4il Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jign4bass Posted January 25, 2015 Report Share Posted January 25, 2015 For mixing mine I use the little Dixie cups like you use in the bathroom. Fold them down and take scissors to cut them about half an inch tall. For mixing stick paper stick q-tips work just fine after you cut off the cotton. Both real cheap and easy to find. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skeeter Posted January 25, 2015 Report Share Posted January 25, 2015 Devcon starts curing quicker below 50% humidity. I wrote this in 2012: http://www.tackleunderground.com/community/topic/24488-how-to-apply-devcon/ I also posted in December about the chalk. http://www.tackleunderground.com/community/topic/29134-chalk-in-devcon/ Sorry it all blew up on you brother. You are not the first and won't be the last. Happened to me too. Welcome to crankbait making. Skeeter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
s4il Posted January 25, 2015 Author Report Share Posted January 25, 2015 I just did 3 baits with the recommended clear coat BSI 30 m from Richard Prager, all 3 baits are on lure turner, and all look like glass, very happy with this product, BIG THANKS RICHARD! The devcon is in the trash, not even going to think twice about using this product again. Thx to this site my trouble shooting days are over with /smirk for now anyways. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayburnGuy Posted January 25, 2015 Report Share Posted January 25, 2015 (edited) The one thing that really stands out to me is the amount of time it takes you to measure and mix the epoxy until it's ready to be applied. Five minutes is really pushing the envelope. Even with the 30 minute epoxy you only have about 5 minutes to get it mixed and applied before it starts setting up. As for the plastic cups your using get the kind they bring your pills in at the hospital. They should be available at your local pharmacy and they only cost a couple cents each. They can also be used more than once and there is no need to throw them in the trash after just one use. Any left over epoxy can be left in the bottom of the plastic cup and this allows you to mix multiple batches of epoxy in the same cup. This not only saves you a few cents each time it's also a good way to check how far along the cure is on your baits without touching them. Just feel the epoxy in the bottom of the cup to see if it's cured and that way there are no fingerprints on your bait. I'd also suggest you get some of the Bob Smith 30 minute epoxy. I've been using it for going on 3 years now and like it much better that D2T. I could be wrong, but it seems to me that you have a little longer working time with the B.S. and the bubbles dissipate easier. Another thing I do is stay away from anything made of wood to stir the epoxy with when mixing. I read somewhere that using anything made of wood to stir the epoxy with will introduce more bubbles into the mix. I took a 3/16" welding rod and bent it so the end used for mixing looks something like a shepherds crook. It's bent in such a way that the angle on the bent end matches the angle on the side of the mixing cups I use. This makes it easy to wipe down the sides without having to change the angle by moving my hand. I just stick the end into the mix and start mixing and all it takes to wipe down the sides is simply move the stirrer over a small bit. good luck, Ben Edited January 25, 2015 by RayburnGuy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLT785 Posted January 25, 2015 Report Share Posted January 25, 2015 I use the bathroom size Dixie cups, for stirring sticks, after using plastic disposable paint brushes from Wally's, I cut a few inches of the handle off. Haven't had any problems yet, will look out for the "chalk". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark poulson Posted January 25, 2015 Report Share Posted January 25, 2015 I use the salsa cups from my local Mexican food take out restaurant. I wash them with dish soap in the kitchen sink, and they work great. Or I mix a small amount on a piece of duct tape I put onto the front part of my work bench. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bass100 Posted January 25, 2015 Report Share Posted January 25, 2015 I have had cloudiness happen many years ago and it was because I used a popsickle stick which had moisture in it. If it was from chalk all of your mixed epoxy would change color and not just in streaks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bass100 Posted January 25, 2015 Report Share Posted January 25, 2015 I have emailed the company that makes Devcon and asked them to clear up whether their product is still clear or if it has chalk in it or not. I have no problems with my D2T and I have used 5 tubes from Ace Hardware in the last 8 days but if you buy it from somewhere else it might have chalk. So hopefully the company will respond and clear this up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Bass Man Posted January 25, 2015 Report Share Posted January 25, 2015 With Devcon, I mix for about 45 seconds, then brush onto lure. I use a big paper clip to mix my epoxy. Works great with far less bubbles. The working time with devcon is far less than the working time with etex. With devcon, I can get 3 baits cleared before going to the drying wheel. With etex, you could probably do 25-30 baits per mixing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobP Posted January 25, 2015 Report Share Posted January 25, 2015 (edited) One thing I want to address is your Devcon versus Etex supposition. I think if you are experienced in using Etex and have been happy with the results, there's no reason to switch to Devcon because you are building diving instead of topwater baits. Anyone who says a Devcon topcoat is stronger than an Etex topcoat of the same thickness is wrong. Etex is the favored epoxy topcoat for many musky bait builders, which says a lot to me. The real difference is that a single coat of Etex is going to be much thinner than a single coat of Devcon due to its thinner viscosity - unless you let the Etex begin to harden for 10-15 minutes before you apply it. If you delay application, I doubt anyone would ever be able to tell the difference. I build bass baits, use Devcon exclusively, know how to mix and apply it, and am very happy with the results. I prefer it because it's quicker to apply, quicker to harden, and the end result is a great topcoat for wood bass baits. But it also requires an expeditious mixing and application regimen compared to Etex. I usually try to coat only 2 baits with Devcon at a time. There are very good Member Submitted Tutorials on both Devcon (by Skeeter) and Etex (by Fatfingers) here on the site. They are worth a look! Edited January 25, 2015 by BobP Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
s4il Posted January 25, 2015 Author Report Share Posted January 25, 2015 (edited) Thx bob for the insight, i myself was a strong advocate of Devcon the first year i started using it, worked great, had no issues with "chalk pigments" as the Box clearly says it may cause (devcon 30m home) when this information was passed onto me from above poster jign4bass i checked my box, and sure enough it says that right on the front, As far as E-tex clear goes, ive only done one coat for each bait, all came out like glass, i may give this a try in the future for crank baits, and see how the durability holds up, i got 3 nice baits coated last night with BSI 30m and all came out crystal clear, thanks again Richard:) I'll continue to use this product on my cranks, but E-tex will be my Choice of clear for top waters, ill take into consideration about doing more than one coat, thanks to everyone on this site, i now feel more confident with my clear coat options. Edited January 25, 2015 by s4il Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bass100 Posted January 25, 2015 Report Share Posted January 25, 2015 Thx bob for the insight, i myself was a strong advocate of Devcon the first year i started using it, worked great, had no issues with "chalk pigments" as the Box clearly says it may cause (devcon 30m home) when this information was passed onto me from above poster jign4bass i checked my box, and sure enough it says that right on the front, As far as E-tex clear goes, ive only done one coat for each bait, all came out like glass, i may give this a try in the future for crank baits, and see how the durability holds up, i got 3 nice baits coated last night with BSI 30m and all came out crystal clear, thanks again Richard:) I'll continue to use this product on my cranks, but E-tex will be my Choice of clear for top waters, ill take into consideration about doing more than one coat, thanks to everyone on this site, i now feel more confident with my clear coat options. Is this what your box says? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
s4il Posted January 25, 2015 Author Report Share Posted January 25, 2015 (edited) i got the 4.25 Fl oz (125ml) big bottles of the home kit, yes thats what it says Edited January 25, 2015 by s4il Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bass100 Posted January 25, 2015 Report Share Posted January 25, 2015 OK, just wanted to make sure you were using the same product that I have been using. I sent ITW an email and I will call them tomorrow. I don't read it as there is chalk in the product I read it as you can add chalk to tint it. This is the second time this has come up so I will get a hold of them and post their response. I will also ask them about your cloudiness and let you know. If anybody else wants to call here is the # (877) 376-2839. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saltshaker Posted January 26, 2015 Report Share Posted January 26, 2015 I agree 100% with Bob on the Devcon vs Etex issue. My lures have been used all over Canada where some of the most vicious teeth reside and the feedback I've gotten about Etex is quite positive. Now that I coat the Etex with KBS...them teeth don't stand a chance. Etex is not quite as sissified as some may want to think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayburnGuy Posted January 26, 2015 Report Share Posted January 26, 2015 (edited) The thing about Etex is that it has some flex to it where D2T does not. D2T is much, much harder than Etex and a highly concentrated force (think the point of a Musky tooth) can make cracks in the D2T. The same thing can be said about crashing lures into rocks, boat docks and other unforgiving surfaces. At least that's what they told me at Epoxy school. Ben Edited January 26, 2015 by RayburnGuy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bass100 Posted January 26, 2015 Report Share Posted January 26, 2015 I have never used Etex and would love to give it a try. What is the mixing ratio? For example: 1:1 by volume or 1:1 by weight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
s4il Posted January 26, 2015 Author Report Share Posted January 26, 2015 So i'm curious to know Has anyone ever used E-tex as a top coat OVER another Coat of a different brand of epoxy? Or is that just better to go with 2 top coats of the same brand, just a thought....not sure if im going to get flamed putting that up in the air for discussion. lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayburnGuy Posted January 26, 2015 Report Share Posted January 26, 2015 It's equal parts by volume bass100. Haven't tried that s4il. Etex is usually considered to take multiple coats to be an effective top coat and since I don't fish for toothy critters the extra time and effort is not worth it for me. Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saltshaker Posted January 26, 2015 Report Share Posted January 26, 2015 (edited) s4il, I've used Diamond epoxy and then Etex on top of that. I used the Diamond because I was in somewhat of a hurry and didn't wanna wait on the Etex. Diamond "dries" at a much faster rate. If I weren't so satisfied with Etex...I'd give Diamond a permanent spot on my work bench. Oh, to answer your question...I didn't see any problems and haven't heard of any since. I don't make a habit of doing that, but, I do occasionally. Edited January 26, 2015 by saltshaker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobP Posted January 26, 2015 Report Share Posted January 26, 2015 As far as I know, any epoxy will cure over any other kind of cured epoxy (or other type of topcoat) just fine. You would have to examine it microscopically to determine if it created 2 separate coatings or chemically bonded into one monolithic coat. It is said that epoxy takes about a week to final cure and if you recoat within several days, you get one coating. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
