mark poulson Posted April 26, 2015 Report Share Posted April 26, 2015 (edited) I had several rat baits, dipped in AC1315 and painted with Createx/Wicked White colors develop problems. It was posted earlier here that someone (sorry I don't remember who) had problems with soft plastics melting the AC1315 finish. At that time, I draped a couple of Robo worms over some cranks I had dipped, and left them for a week, with no problems. Well, I opened my wake bait box Friday, and found that all four of the jointed rat baits I had made, and equipped with some old BPS floating worms for tails, had problems. The tails had been folded back over the lure bodies for storage, and I hadn't opened that box for several months. Where the worms had been in contact with the lure bodies the AC1315 had melted, on a couple all the way through to the PVC trimboard body. The worms were vintage 2000, so they may have been a different formulation than the Robo worms I draped over the cranks for a test, or maybe they just stayed in a hot plano box in a tackle locker too long, but the finish and the paint were affected. When I saw what happened, I took the worms off the baits and stored them separately, so I could reattach them when I want to use the baits. The baits are still melted and stick today, Sunday, so I have them hanging over my bench to deal with, somehow. Maybe just wipe with alcohol and redip. I'll let you know what I figure out. I do know I won't be leaving the worm tails attached after I've finished throwing the baits next time! Doh!!!! Edited April 26, 2015 by mark poulson Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KelpKritter Posted April 27, 2015 Report Share Posted April 27, 2015 Mark, I have found, at least so far, that I prefer the AC1315 much better than the GST concrete sealers for hardness and issues of curing fully on my hardbaits. Although I was having some issues with the GST not fully curing on a number of baits of different color schemes I have had a few issues with the AC1315 but only with Createx and Folk Art Pearl Whites. I also had a plastic swimbait that came in contact with a bait with one of these brands white color and had the plastic start to melt but I caught it after only a few days. It was not melting into the hardbait at the color change. When I get a little more time I want to do some more specific testing to see if I can isolate the problem. DaveB. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark poulson Posted April 27, 2015 Author Report Share Posted April 27, 2015 Dave, I have had really good luck with the AC1315, especially over plastic baits. I also have found that Createx white seems to be more affected, too. Maybe it has something to do with the pigments. I find that I have to dip really fast, or the solvent softens any paint that is a little thicker. I am just going to keep the soft plastics away from my hard baits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
llokkii Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 I've been using GST since I first came across that thread. I've found that if I dip my baits quickly in the GST, place them on my lure turner and then use my ceramic heater to blow warm air over them for an hour or two, they get rock hard and cure better. I do all of this outside as to avoid any off-gassing issues. I've also found that as a result of doing this, the lures are less likely to have an "odor" to them. Since I haven't used the AC1315 yet ( I still have half a gallon of GST) I can't say for sure if this would work or even help, but someone might be able to give it a try and see. I have kept my baits with other commercial baits and haven't had any issues yet, but I'm in my tackle boxes almost daily. I also keep my soft plastics stored separately (most of the time). I have issues with Createx white too but only on baits that seem to have smoother bodies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bois d'Arc Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 .........I have issues with Createx white too but only on baits that seem to have smoother bodies. Second this comment!!! Createx White paints...Opaque, Transparent and Pearlescent seem to be pretty touchy when used with concrete sealers and particularly over a slick sided blank. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bass01 Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 I haven't had that problem yet but I dip the bait in Future/Pledge and let dry an hour or two before I use AC1315 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark poulson Posted April 29, 2015 Author Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 I haven't had that problem yet but I dip the bait in Future/Pledge and let dry an hour or two before I use AC1315 Maybe shooting a coat of gloss Createx before dipping would make the film strength stronger, so it won't wrinkle. I'll try the next time I paint a bait. Thanks for the idea! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
llokkii Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 I've tried shooting a thin coat of Createx gloss on them. I still ended up getting wrinkles, but they were smaller and more compact than the larger cracks that showed up on the baits I didn't spray with the gloss. White and orange and pearlized blue are my banes right now. Thinking I might try switching to a different primer to see if that helps, followed by dipping in Pledge. I'll be dipping some baits here at the end of next week (I hope) so I'll check it out too. I will also give the gloss Createx another shot. Can't hurt to see if I get different results. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayburnGuy Posted April 30, 2015 Report Share Posted April 30, 2015 I don't have a dog in this hunt, but it makes me wonder why some people are having trouble with the AC1315 and others are not. Could it be that the folks having trouble aren't getting their paint completely dry before applying the top coat? Any moisture left behind can play the dickens with a number of different top coats. Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
llokkii Posted April 30, 2015 Report Share Posted April 30, 2015 That was my first thought too, so not only did I only spray one light coat of white on my crankbait, I used my heat gun on it immediately after I was finished. I then let it air dry inside at 73 degrees for a week and then I used my heat gun on it again before letting it air dry another two days. I kept my GST at room temperature in the same room as my crankbait. (I thought any temperature variations might be a culptrit. When i was ready to dip,I took everything outside, dipped it and the cracking/wrinkling was immediate. I use an Iwata airbrush and that coat of white was light. Its only one of three colors I have issues with. The rest are just fine. Weird. I'll find a solution. Hopefully soon. I have about a dozen baits I am going to have to repaint and clearcoat because of it. Hoping the Pledge with Future does the trick. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayburnGuy Posted April 30, 2015 Report Share Posted April 30, 2015 That was my first thought too, so not only did I only spray one light coat of white on my crankbait, I used my heat gun on it immediately after I was finished. I then let it air dry inside at 73 degrees for a week and then I used my heat gun on it again before letting it air dry another two days. I kept my GST at room temperature in the same room as my crankbait. (I thought any temperature variations might be a culptrit. When i was ready to dip,I took everything outside, dipped it and the cracking/wrinkling was immediate. I use an Iwata airbrush and that coat of white was light. Its only one of three colors I have issues with. The rest are just fine. Weird. I'll find a solution. Hopefully soon. I have about a dozen baits I am going to have to repaint and clearcoat because of it. Hoping the Pledge with Future does the trick. Sure doesn't sound like there's any issue with moisture then. Like so many other things some stuff works for some and not for others. Good luck in finding a cure llokkii. Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
llokkii Posted April 30, 2015 Report Share Posted April 30, 2015 Thanks. I hope I find something that works so I can post it back here. You guys have been a ton of help to me and I am hoping I can return the favor. Keep those lines wet! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ravenlures Posted April 30, 2015 Report Share Posted April 30, 2015 Since I make Musky baits I use only E-tex. I think if the builders would put their procedures down so they can be compared one might find what is going wrong or right, not how they build the bait but how they finish the bait. Just my two cents for what its worth. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bubbadoyle Posted April 30, 2015 Report Share Posted April 30, 2015 (edited) That was my first thought too, so not only did I only spray one light coat of white on my crankbait, I used my heat gun on it immediately after I was finished. I then let it air dry inside at 73 degrees for a week and then I used my heat gun on it again before letting it air dry another two days. I kept my GST at room temperature in the same room as my crankbait. (I thought any temperature variations might be a culptrit. When i was ready to dip,I took everything outside, dipped it and the cracking/wrinkling was immediate. I use an Iwata airbrush and that coat of white was light. Its only one of three colors I have issues with. The rest are just fine. Weird. I'll find a solution. Hopefully soon. I have about a dozen baits I am going to have to repaint and clearcoat because of it. Hoping the Pledge with Future does the trick. I had many problems with the wrinkling and cracking as well with createx. I sprayed light coats and heat set well. Still had problems. Started dipping in pledge and it cured about 99% of the wrinkles. I still might have a small one here or there but it seems it is on about 1 out of 10 baits and usually one that I dipped in ac1315 probably before the pledge was fully cured. If I wait 24 hours after applying pledge to dip in ac1315 I do not get wrinkles. Edited April 30, 2015 by Bubbadoyle 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
llokkii Posted May 1, 2015 Report Share Posted May 1, 2015 Thanks Bubbadoyle. I'm definitely going to try the Pledge the next batch of baits I dip. I like the ratio of good baits to that bait that wrinkles a little bit. Since most of these baits are for me, I can live with a minor wrinkle or two but if I can get that paint to stop wrinkling on certain colors, I'll definitely be a happy guy! right now I am avoiding certain colors and patterns because I know that those colors will wrinkle regardless. I appreciate the feedback! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobP Posted May 1, 2015 Report Share Posted May 1, 2015 I bet the Pledge solves the problem. I tried using it as an extender for some Createx, got some in the barrel of my brush and had to use pliers to remove the needle after the stuff had dried and cemented the needle into the packing - so it's definitely not the same thing as the clear acrylics sold for airbrushes. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark poulson Posted May 1, 2015 Author Report Share Posted May 1, 2015 I wonder if a dip in Pledge after the AC1315 would protect against interactions with soft bait plastisol? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gone2long Posted May 1, 2015 Report Share Posted May 1, 2015 I don't use the concrete sealers but I always inter coat clear with future/pledge and have never had a paint problem regarding top coats I find that it plays quite nicely with acrylic paint. I like Bob Smith epoxy and I'm probably not pumping out as many baits as many on here do but the future/pledge leaves a nice hard top coat for the epoxy to bond to. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kustom Krankz Posted May 1, 2015 Report Share Posted May 1, 2015 (edited) mark and I have talked about this wrinkling issue and since I started using testors white and pearls I have not had one issue with it- just my .02- my procedure is as follows if it helps- paint bait as usual ,drying with hairdryer between coats- into hotbox @110 degrees for 15 min. or so- remove and dip first coat of ac 1315- back in hotbox for 15 0r 20 min- dip again- usually do this 4 times and bait is done the next day- a lot of times I will leave baits in the box for an extra 12 hrs or so while I am at work and they are rock hard when I return to them-no smell at all- I have done probably 60-70 baits with this process in the last month or so and not one problem- got on a good school of smaller bass and caught probably 50-60 on one little john I had painted. it was pretty scratched up as you can imagine- took it home, removed the hooks ,hit it with some 500 grit sandpaper, and two dips later I could have sold it as a new bait- as far as toothy critters go ,an epoxy is probably the best bet- as far as bass fishing cranks go, i'll be using this stuff- thanks to mark Paulson for the insight ! Edited May 1, 2015 by Kustom Krankz 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bois d'Arc Posted May 11, 2015 Report Share Posted May 11, 2015 Had problems with wrinkling on some slick sided baits....tried everything to control the wrinkles... with no positive results. Out of desperation I tried dipping the painted lures into a thinned down polyacrylic clear...then shaking as much of the stuff off as possible, before hanging the lure to dry. Let the lure cure for about a week...some professional woodworking folks say this stuff takes about a month to fully cure...then dipped the lure in AC1315 three times letting it cure overnight in a dehydrator between each dip. After several trips to the lake and lots of use the lures are holding up very well. So far no problems with the finish coat. I’ve done this with Eagle and Garco product, too. Maybe someone else who has paint wrinkling problems is willing to try this process and follow up with their results? 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bois d'Arc Posted May 18, 2015 Report Share Posted May 18, 2015 Anyone willing to try this? Lots of folks still having wrinkled paint issues and this seems to be a good fix....so far . Needing someone else to try it and post the results....email me for details if you're interested in testing this out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JBlaze Posted June 2, 2015 Report Share Posted June 2, 2015 Just took the plunge and ordered a gallon of the AC1315 sealer, according to The person I talked to at Direct Colors, I should receive it by Thursday. I have been a D2T fan forever and recently bought the 8oz bottles of d2t and with tax it was close to 18 dollars. If I can learn to make do with this stuff, then it will be a bargain. I have read everything That has been posted on this stuff and actually feel pretty good about it but may be posing a few questions soon. Actually, I already have one. I read a lot about it wrinkling acrylic colors. What about dipping powder coated jigs to protect the stick on eyes from falling off. Has anyone used it for that purpose? John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JBlaze Posted June 13, 2015 Report Share Posted June 13, 2015 Got my answer, I am very happy with the AC1315 used as a clear coat on a jig. I built some 1/4 and 3/4 swim bait heads gave them two dips in the stuff about an hour apart and cannot get a fingernail under the eyes so I believe they are locked on and protected. I painted the top and sides of these with an industrial sharpie and the AC1315 did not cause it to run. Will post a pic in gallery when I get the blades on them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark poulson Posted June 14, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 14, 2015 Just know that you can't leave a soft plastic trailer attached for more than a day or two, or it will melt the AC1315. It holds up fine for a day's fishing, and, as long as you take the trailer off after each fishing trip, it will last until you lose the swimbait heads. If you put a barrier coat of clear nail polish where the plastic touches the jig head, that will make it almost bulletproof, and you can leave your soft plastics attached a lot longer, but you need to be sure they aren't folded over and contacting the part that doesn't have nail polish on it. You can also redip them if they get scuffed up, and it bonds to the old coat fine. I just wipe down with denatured alcohol first, to remove any dirt and oils. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JBlaze Posted June 15, 2015 Report Share Posted June 15, 2015 Thanks Mark, Went out today and just made that mistake, I left plastic grubs on two of them. It is 11 bells here right now, so I will take them off first thing in the morning. Again, thanks for that tip. Will post pic of them tomorrow. Threw one for a couple of hours over and on some gravel points and I felt that the AC 1315 held up very well. Thanks for all the positive statements and the few drawbacks that you and others have posted about this sealer. I am pretty cautious about trying new things but this one got my attention and I think it has its place and I'm going to like it. John 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
