Mixing & Applying Bsi 30 Minute Epoxy

[goolies]

I just started using Bob Smith 30 minute epoxy. Can someone suggest the best technique for mixing it quickly and thoroughly without introducing bubbles? When I used Envirotex Lite I had plenty of time and could use a heat gun to get bubbles out after applying it to the bait. Bubbles in the BSI don't seem to respond to a heat gun. Thanks.

Andy

[BobP]

I think Rayburn Guy uses BS epoxy so maybe he can help.  Using Devcon 2 Ton, I drip a few drops of denatured alcohol into my mixed epoxy and blend it in to thin the mix a little.  That seems to dispel bubbles pretty well.  I also use a flat artist's brush that has fine nylon bristles to apply the epoxy.  The fine bristles tend to break any bubbles as you brush it on the lure (unlike brushes like flux brushes).  I'm pretty fanatical about measuring and mixing epoxy.  When mixed, it's usually a milky white color from the air I whipped into it, but using the above methods I still get a perfect bubble free topcoat.    

[RayburnGuy]

I don't worry about bubbles when mixing the BS epoxy. The only thing I care about is getting it thoroughly mixed so it cures properly so I mix the crap out of it. Once it's mixed I add a few drops of denatured alcohol and mix again. Once the alcohol is completely incorporated into the epoxy I hold the mixing cup up to my mouth and exhale on it. Not blowing, but exhaling with an open mouth. This provides a bit of warmth as well as carbon dioxide onto the mix. This will cause the bubbles to rise to the surface and pop.

 

The use of a soft, fine hair brush will also help pop any bubbles that may have been missed. Keeping the brush loaded with epoxy while brushing it on will also help keep bubbles out of the top coat. Dragging a dry brush over epoxy that's already on the lure will introduce bubbles back into the epoxy.

 

Hope this helps.

 

Ben

[BobP]

I think instead of "p-o-p" we're gonna have to start using "burst".  This POP gremlin has been around awhile and just doesn't seem to die!

[goolies]

Thanks for the advice guys.

[goolies]

I believe I read in another thread about 7-8 drops of denatured alcohol per tablespoon of epoxy. Does that sound right?

[Musky Glenn]

I use Bob Smith's epoxy and don't have a problem with air bubbles. I puddle two nickle size spots of each part of the epoxy next to each other and compare them for size. I only use a small 1/4 inch brush to stir the two parts of the epoxy. When I brush it on I start at the top of the lure and work toward the bottom end making sure that I don't miss spots. I brush it out as thin as I can so it won't run when I hang it to dry. By brushing it thin I just don't get air bubbles introduced into the finish. I don't turn the lure, just hang to dry. I don't use alcohol.

Edited October 5, 2015 by Musky Glenn

[BobP]

I dip my brush in the DA and shake it into the mixed epoxy, then blend. You don't need a lot, just enough to thin it slightly. Just use a few drops at a time until it's the viscosity you want. It doesn't take much. It will also extend the brush time by about a minute, but will not appreciably extend the final curing time.

Edited October 5, 2015 by BobP

[RayburnGuy]

I think instead of "p-o-p" we're gonna have to start using "burst".  This POP gremlin has been around awhile and just doesn't seem to die!

 

Yes, I never seem to remember the problem with typing "p-o-p" without the dashes. It's funny that it's the only word that this happens too. There are many other words and phrases in the glossary that get used every day and they never show up anymore.

 

Ben

[goolies]

I tried top coating another 7" bait last night with the BSI.  The result was a very uneven coat.  I mixed the 2 parts vigorously for 3-4 minutes and then stirred in 5 small drops of DA.  I then exhaled on the mixture several times and could see a majority of the bubbles burst.  I applied the epoxy with a 1/4" wide soft hair brush in long strokes.  The mixture may still be a little to thick.  Maybe I need to add more DA.  You can see the waviness on the bottom of the bait in the photo. Thoughts?

 

Edited October 6, 2015 by goolies

[Vodkaman]

Are you using a lure turner?

 

Perhaps a stiffer brush, will enable you to glob it on and brush it out much quicker. The idea is not to get a smooth finish with the brush, but to make sure the whole bait is covered. The epoxy then self levels to give you the finish.

 

Either you are taking too long or not turning the lure enough. The top of the lure looks fine, so I presume not turning enough.

 

DAve

[RayburnGuy]

Add denatured alcohol in small increments until you can feel the viscosity of the epoxy change enough that you can actually tell the difference when stirring it. If your adding 5 drops and can't feel the difference then you need to add a couple more drops. I've overdone it with the alcohol before and the epoxy got thin enough that I wondered if it would ever cure. It took it a good bit longer, but it did finally cure. Was it as strong as it is when mixed with fewer drops? I don't know, but it did cure.

 

As Dave said, when brushing the epoxy on I don't try to brush it on as if I were painting. I glob it on to get the bait covered and then, brushing toward the tail, I brush off the excess before putting it on the turner.

 

Try adding a couple more drops of DA and see what that does. If that doesn't help then you could be taking too long when mixing.

 

Ben

 

p.s. I just went back and re-read your last post. Mixing for 3 to 4 minutes is taking way too much time. Mixing the epoxy, adding DA and then re-mixing should take you around a minute at most. That's why I stir the puddin' out of it and don't worry about the bubbles while mixing it. The less time you spend mixing the more time you'll have to brush it on the lure. Your also covering a larger bait and that takes more time. You need to get it on and even it out quickly.

 

Another thing that's probably causing you problems. It takes more epoxy to cover a lure that size than it does most bass sized cranks. Five drops of DA isn't enough.

Edited October 6, 2015 by RayburnGuy

[goolies]

I am using a turner.  It's taking about 1/4 oz of mixed epoxy to cover this bait.The next one I will try mixing it and thinning it quicker (about a minute).  I will also thin it more.  I'm realizing now that I can not treat the BSI like Envirotex.  I'm taking too long.  Thanks guys.

 

Andy

Edited October 6, 2015 by goolies

[Vodkaman]

Good comments by Ben. I am confident that you will nail it next time.

 

Dave

[RayburnGuy]

I would suggest mixing a small batch as a test sample to be applied on a piece of scrap wood. This would be just to make sure you have it mixed properly and to avoid messing up another bait. Even though you need to mix it quickly it still needs to be mixed thoroughly or we run into the problem of it not curing to a hard finish. All this may seem like a lot of hoops to jump through, but once you get it down it will be no more difficult than brushing your teeth.

 

Good luck and let us know how it goes.

 

Ben

[BobP]

Guys mix epoxy with lots of different tools, in lots of different containers.  I mix in a jar cap lined with foil with a 1/2" wide strip cut from a credit card.  The strip moves a lot of epoxy so allows me to get a thorough mix within a minute or so.  It does stir air into the mix and the epoxy looks like milk when finished.  But after mixing in some DA, the bubbles mostly disappear and then completely disappear as I brush it on the lure with a fine bristle brush.  Like most things, you just have to develop a routine that gets the results you want in the time allowed.  I get about a 3 minute window in which to brush "30 minute" epoxy after mixing and thinning it.  Quite different from Envirotex Lite.

[JRammit]

Bottom of a beer can, great mixing bowl!... And im recycling

[Vodkaman]

I like the concave bottom of a can too. The same can bottom can be used many times, by simply wiping out with a tissue and leaving the residue to level.

 

For stirring, I use a wooden spatula with rounded ends. After use, I again wipe off and leave to cure. Each time of use, the spatula improves with the layer of cured epoxy. If it gets too thick, I will give it a quick grind on the belt sander.

 

If I don't have a can bottom available, I will use modelling clay and a layer of cling film to create a dish. I dispose of the plastic film and apply a new layer, ready for the next use.

 

Dave

[JRammit]

I usually dont run out of empty beer cans... But if i do, i can make another pretty quick!

[Vodkaman]

JR - I stopped drinking beer, coke and other canned drinks about 7 years ago. I gave up beer purely for financial reasons, and canned drinks for health reasons. I do like beer and pub life, it was hard, but necessary to give it up.

 

Dave

[RayburnGuy]

Don't remember where I read it, but wherever it was it was recommended not to use wood to mix epoxy. The claim was that it introduced more bubbles. I have no proof of whether it does or doesn't, but this led me to make a stir stick out of a 5/32" welding rod. It was bent into a shape similar to a shepherds crook. I mix epoxy in the little plastic cups like the ones they bring your medicine in while your in the hospital. They are readily available at your local pharmacy and have graduated measurement markings on the sides of the cup. They only cost a few cents each and I just let the epoxy harden in the bottom of the cup to be used again and again until it's almost full. After that they're tossed in the trash. That way I'm not wasting time and materials cleaning up mixing containers. Also the "shepherds crook" stirring tool is bent at such an angle that it makes wiping down the sides of the cup easy while mixing.

 

@JR

 

The alcohol is supposed to go into the epoxy. Not the bait builder.

 

Ben

[JRammit]

I knew i was doing something wrong

[JRammit]

JR - I stopped drinking beer, coke and other canned drinks about 7 years ago. I gave up beer purely for financial reasons, and canned drinks for health reasons. I do like beer and pub life, it was hard, but necessary to give it up.

Dave

Not a bad thing... If i tried to give up beer, nobody would like me for a while!

[cadman]

Don't remember where I read it, but wherever it was it was recommended not to use wood to mix epoxy. The claim was that it introduced more bubbles. I have no proof of whether it does or doesn't, but this led me to make a stir stick out of a 5/32" welding rod. It was bent into a shape similar to a shepherds crook. I mix epoxy in the little plastic cups like the ones they bring your medicine in while your in the hospital. They are readily available at your local pharmacy and have graduated measurement markings on the sides of the cup. They only cost a few cents each and I just let the epoxy harden in the bottom of the cup to be used again and again until it's almost full. After that they're tossed in the trash. That way I'm not wasting time and materials cleaning up mixing containers. Also the "shepherds crook" stirring tool is bent at such an angle that it makes wiping down the sides of the cup easy while mixing.

 

@JR

 

The alcohol is supposed to go into the epoxy. Not the bait builder.

 

Ben

Hey Ben,

    I use a small wood coffee stirrer to mix my epoxy with no problem. However I use Devcon and E-tex. I can tell you that when I mix it vigorously, I do see small air bubbles in the epoxy mix, but when I brush it on, it is as clear as glass when it cures. The other thing is that I only do painted lead jigs, some up to 2 oz., and never any issues. I can tell you guys this that temperature in the room has a lot to do with how the epoxy behaves. To me the warmer it is in the working area, the better the results. This is just some of my experience with epoxies.

[Richard Prager]

I've been using BSI 30 minute slow cure for about 4 years now. This is what I do and works at least 99% of the time. First off, I epoxy inside. I have a shot glass with DA in it sitting right there for me.I don't use the container it comes in because after a while dipping the brush in it contaminates it. I warm up the bottles with a heat gun so it flows out of the bottle nicely. I'm dying if I'm lying but I've said it before and I'll say it again. I squeeze into a plastic cup used for measuring medicine a 5 count of each part. Seriously I count to 5...I mix the crap out of it it with a cordless drill and a piece of wire bent at 90 degrees for about 15 seconds. I dip my entire Great Planes epoxy brush into the shot glass with the DA and and stir it a little with the mixed epoxy This temporary thins it and disperses ALL bubbles. I do my first of 2 baits like this. I apply it the same way every time and load the brush up so the epoxy "flows" onto the bait as opposed to pulling it. As it thickens, any missed spots can be gone over. i also spray my baits with something to cover any oils or contamination that might be on the bait. The second bait, i don't us the DA just the epoxy the way it is. If i rush I can do 3 baits but i am happy with 2. Out goes the .04 cent cup and the .15 brush. I rather spend the money than trying to pick out hairs or miss some and then realize they are now part of the bait. I do 10 baits in 30 minutes, 20 in an hour taking my time. After an hour on the rack, I put a couple of indoor 65 watt flood lights for a few hours. Not really for the heat but for the humidity. BSI is nothing like e-tex and is very forgiving as far as mixing and measuring. I only had issues when I was working out doors and it was either cold or high humidity. I do about 40 baits a week. When doing lipless baits or others with sharp edges, I epoxy these as the second of the two baits because the epoxy starts to thicken and does not pull away. I spend a little more on these brushes but it only takes 2 bad epoxy jobs negate any savings using other supplies plus i would have to repaint and re finish said baits. Like I said this is what works for me and never have any baits coming back.