Eyectcher Posted January 20, 2017 Report Share Posted January 20, 2017 Hi everyone hope everyone is well guys i have some rapalas that are discontinued i did not know till i went shopping to pic up a bunch for painting which i do quite a bit of so not finding any on the shelf i asked the guy at the counter and found out the truth he did find two in the back the lure is rapala ttm20 basicly a great trolling lure its flat sided with a big lip so ive searched and found some online but the price is just crazy so i have recently had a bug to start carveing some of my own and through my research i have found that alot of lure makers are turning to pvc the original is balsa i have acquired all the tools and am set up i am just wondering what are the pro and cons to useing pvc vs balsa and also will the lure have the same action and one thing id like to ask you pros is there something i should be doing or watching out for to have or be able to tune the lure to track straight i usually run six to eight rods and an out of tune crankbait can cause alot of problems guys any info or help would be very greatly appreciated thank you guys sincerely gino Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark poulson Posted January 20, 2017 Report Share Posted January 20, 2017 I would use PVC trimboard, because it is more durable than balsa, easy to shape, and totally waterproof, so hook rash from trolling isn't an issue. When I build cranks, I turn both hook hangers crosswise, so the treble has one hook facing forward, and the other two hooks straddle the bait, which really cuts down on hook rash, too. The PVC trimboard is almost as buoyant as med density balsa, so it makes lively cranks. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobP Posted January 21, 2017 Report Share Posted January 21, 2017 I like and use a lot of Rapala crankbaits made from balsa. However, I don't and I can't use all of the manufacturing methods that they use in producing their baits. If you copy one of their baits very closely in terms of shape, weight, and exterior design detail, you should be able to get what you want. Will it be EXACTLY the same in performance? That is determined only by the fish you run it past and how exact you can make the copies. As far as tuning goes, I presume you as an experienced fisherman know how to tune a crankbait's line tie to make it run straight. I will say that most guys don't understand the level of detail necessary to copy a bait closely enough to get it to perform just like its commercial counterpart. Little niggling differences can make a big difference. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eyectcher Posted January 21, 2017 Author Report Share Posted January 21, 2017 Thank you all for tour hwlp i am goung to pick up a couple boards of pvc and give it a try thanka again guys Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayburnGuy Posted January 21, 2017 Report Share Posted January 21, 2017 If your just trying to match the size and shape of a bait you can use pretty much any material you want. If your also trying to duplicate the action then IMO your better off using the same material the original is made from. This is in addition to the things Bob pointed out above. Ben 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jigginpig Posted January 21, 2017 Report Share Posted January 21, 2017 I sorta like the idea of a clone-bait that is "detuned" a little in comparison to the bait it is attempting to replicate. I subscribe to the notion that part of the "hot bait" phenomena is that the fish can sorta get hip to a certain combination of flash and sound. No clue if this holds true for inland oceans such as Lake Erie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SW Lures Posted January 21, 2017 Report Share Posted January 21, 2017 I like/really like Rapala's for my crankbait. I just started using them when I became a adult and it took awhile before I started looking at other manufactures. I don't copy much manufactures baits but I see a lot in my baits the Rapala characteristics. Shad Raps especially. You asked how to keep the bait running true. Just put center lines on both sides of the wood blank. Practice makes perfect as the sayin goes, which is true. "Symmetry and body balance" is the words here. The more you get the shape equal on both sides of the center lines, the better your bait. Go slow, take your time. I went back and read your post and you didn't mentioned depth. That bait runs about 20'? Remember the lip/bill most be in line and the shape can change action. Ballast location helps with the dive depth also. I have one that runs in the 25-30' range. Setting on the water surface the tails is up out of the water. Other words the weight is forward in the bait. But yet in 45° water it slightly floats. As far as what material to use IMO? I'll leave that alone because you ask between two. I will ask this, what species are you fishing for? Dale 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JRammit Posted January 21, 2017 Report Share Posted January 21, 2017 Having a convenient place to test a crank bait is the most valuable tool imo Last summer I bought an above ground pool "for the family"... It's a great test tank! But buying a pool just to build fishing lures may sound too extreme to some people.... So anything that holds water can be of use Bath tub, kiddy pool, cow trough... Anything you can run the bait thru to see it run true before putting all that work forth to finish it As Mark stated, this is where PVC can be your friend... You can test different lip sizes/shapes.. Line tie locations.. Ballast placement and all before painting or sealing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SW Lures Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 I pick some PVC up this afternoon. I still have some things to do before starting with this project but I do have some now. I told you Mark that I would give it a try. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodkaman Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 I second JR's opinion on testing tanks. A tank is one of those items that you don't think you need until you have one. The advantage, especially a raised tank (above ground) is that you can get up close and see what is going on. You can even shoot good video and slow the action down. By shooting swim video of slight modifications, you can identify the often subtle effects. Understanding cause and effect is vital, otherwise you are stabbing in the dark with trial and error. Dave 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SW Lures Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 My test station is shut down for the winter. I found a private pond for testing until spring. JR and VMan are right about clear water. I'm going to start using vid's for learning more about the actions of lures. I'll have to deal with it for a few months. Heck I may catch a few fish in the mean time. Dale Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobP Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 Didn't realize we're talking about a deep runner bait. They're the hardest Baits to get right in my experience because the front/rear balance of the bait is yet another thing that has to be exactly right for them to run and perform correctly. It can take a lot of prototypes to get one working well. Knowing what I know from a couple of decades of lure building, if I were a neophyte and was just interested in one bait, I would be scouring EBay or other sources to buy them rather than gearing up to make them unless I just wanted to get into the hobby. It's fun but it is challenging, sort of like playing golf. It takes time and practice and no matter how good you think you are getting, there's always going to be room for improvement. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eyectcher Posted January 22, 2017 Author Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 14 hours ago, DaleSW said: I like/really like Rapala's for my crankbait. I just started using them when I became a adult and it took awhile before I started looking at other manufactures. I don't copy much manufactures baits but I see a lot in my baits the Rapala characteristics. Shad Raps especially. You asked how to keep the bait running true. Just put center lines on both sides of the wood blank. Practice makes perfect as the sayin goes, which is true. "Symmetry and body balance" is the words here. The more you get the shape equal on both sides of the center lines, the better your bait. Go slow, take your time. I went back and read your post and you didn't mentioned depth. That bait runs about 20'? Remember the lip/bill most be in line and the shape can change action. Ballast location helps with the dive depth also. I have one that runs in the 25-30' range. Setting on the water surface the tails is up out of the water. Other words the weight is forward in the bait. But yet in 45° water it slightly floats. As far as what material to use IMO? I'll leave that alone because you ask between two. I will ask this, what species are you fishing for? Dale Hi dale thank you for your help dale i fish lake erie for walleye really dale if i could buy the baits in question i would buy them but since they are discountinued i have found some bit the price is just crazy and i have been thinking about making some cranbaits for awhile funny thing is when im moose hunting and i start getting bored sitting i will sometimes grab a branch or piece of branch of the floor and try to carve something with my hunting knife and i am not good at that at all so keeping that in mind i always shyed away from lure building but looking at all the posts on here actually encouraged me to start im a very good painter and buy alot of lures that are in the bargin bin but that to is getting expensive but i will take your advice on the ballast one quick question what would you suggest for the lip material i see most guys use circut board which i have no idea what it is or where to get it ive thought about lexan what i was thinking about doing with lexan or some type of durable plastic is to take the original plug and makeing sort of a jig or form and heating up the lip material and mould it the same as the manufacturers lip i will give both pvc and balsa a try and see what gives me better results as gor testing a friend of mine manages a hotel that has an indoor pool so i can use that after hours again thanks to sll of uou for your advise your truly a good bunch of guys on this board i will post my results and all my steps in the process thank you gino Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SW Lures Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 Lexan is a good material for trolling. The 1/16" is what most here uses when making baits. Lol...... I use 1/8" thick when I first started. I still got some of them. I like this more around rocky waters. However BobP and I seem to fish for the same species and about the same types of water and he now thinks circuit board will stand up. I'll find out about that one soon enough. Circuit board/fiberboard is a very thin material that has a characteristic that performs very well for bills/lips/bibs. It comes in a good variety of colors. Here's one location for the standard color. It can be painted and sealed, I dont totally paint, I cut across the nose of the bait and I don't seal. By the way lexan can to, I do the same as CB (circuit board). Your will find that hard bait making will hit every emotion & nerve you have. But when the dust settles, which it doesn't really totally settle. IT'S FUN!!! Watching a person catch a fish off your baits are more rewarding. Catching one yourself....that's bragging time!! http://www.lurepartsonline.com/Online-Store/Lure-Lips-Bills-Bibs/12x12-Fiberboard-Sheets-1-sq-Foot.html, Good luck, Dale Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SW Lures Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 And oh yeah, test baits as if your fishing, meaning with hooks. Watch that liner in that pool if it has one!!!! You will be fine....you have the TU family behind you.....as it is? LMAO Seriously they will help you find your way. They did and are doing it for me. About the bragging part, I'm going to start changing my profile pic.'s soon and occasionally. No holding the fish arms length away from me either. Dale Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eyectcher Posted January 22, 2017 Author Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 2 hours ago, DaleSW said: And oh yeah, test baits as if your fishing, meaning with hooks. Watch that liner in that pool if it has one!!!! You will be fine....you have the TU family behind you.....as it is? LMAO Seriously they will help you find your way. They did and are doing it for me. About the bragging part, I'm going to start changing my profile pic.'s soon and occasionally. No holding the fish arms length away from me either. Dale Hi dale thanks for the heads up on the lip material i will also post some fish and wont hold them out or photo shop them lol dale what waters and whst do you fish for? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SW Lures Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 I fish for many different species. I am happy with a ultralite for bull bream, I'll go off the coast and fish for tuna. I fish a wide reginal area (mid Atlantic) and will travel further if I get a chance, I have certain areas that I'm fond of. TVA lakes in Tennessee is a hangout for me in the spring. Next month I'll fish for ring/yellow perch in local rivers. After that crappie, after that big bream, bass-smallies and buckets are off and on all the time. Briary Creek lake is a largemouth hangout and local rivers. I go where I believe I will get a chance for this biggest that I have caught. I like going as light as possible in equipment to catch the biggest fish. Your true fishing skills will show doing it like this. Your get a heart check up this way to. Dale Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobP Posted January 23, 2017 Report Share Posted January 23, 2017 Dale, both Lexan and G10 are tough. I use G10 that is half the thickness of the Lexan I would otherwise use on a bait, just because it is much stiffer. Does G10 hold up to trolling over rocks as well as Lexan? Neither should break so we're really talking about lip erosion. Frankly, I don't know. All I know is that it holds up well enough that I'm satisfied. And I like it for the same reason it became popular, namely, its sharp rebound off of hard surfaces that fish seem to favor versus the duller rebound of Lexan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eyectcher Posted January 23, 2017 Author Report Share Posted January 23, 2017 16 hours ago, DaleSW said: I fish for many different species. I am happy with a ultralite for bull bream, I'll go off the coast and fish for tuna. I fish a wide reginal area (mid Atlantic) and will travel further if I get a chance, I have certain areas that I'm fond of. TVA lakes in Tennessee is a hangout for me in the spring. Next month I'll fish for ring/yellow perch in local rivers. After that crappie, after that big bream, bass-smallies and buckets are off and on all the time. Briary Creek lake is a largemouth hangout and local rivers. I go where I believe I will get a chance for this biggest that I have caught. I like going as light as possible in equipment to catch the biggest fish. Your true fishing skills will show doing it like this. Your get a heart check up this way to. Dale Hi dale i fish lake ontario for king salmon also in the summer months on the lightist tackle i can get away with with dale were would i find circut bosrd material Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
