Jl12345 Posted January 2, 2018 Report Share Posted January 2, 2018 (edited) I am looking to make a few molds and I am wondering what is the best material to make them out of POP, Resin , etc. Thank You Edited January 2, 2018 by Jl12345 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anglinarcher Posted January 2, 2018 Report Share Posted January 2, 2018 The answer to that question unfortunately is --- it depends. If your items to be made are plastic, soft plastic, and I assume that it is because of the forum you posted in, then it all comes down to undercuts. If your items have lots of undercuts, then a flexible mold is best. Silicone is a great option for this, and Alumilite HS2 or HS3 are good options to consider. But, because you are using soft plastic, you can still use a stiff mold in many cases. In fact, a stiffer mold is preferable if you are going to inject. So, for a firm mold, Silicone like Alumilite Plat 55 is a great option. HS1 is are also a good idea. You can get a more durable and extremely stiff mold if you make it out of VacMaster 50 which "contains over 50% aluminum". VacMaster is a resin. POP is a fair option in my opinion. It is inexpensive, but fragile, takes special treatment to seal it so the results are smooth, and I find it is not very durable. It is old school, but in many cases, it is all that is available to a lot of our international lure makers. I am not a big fan of it, but it should not be discounted. Now, if your items are hard plastic, resin lures, lead, etc., then the suggestions above may change some, but "unfortunately is --- it depends." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jl12345 Posted January 2, 2018 Author Report Share Posted January 2, 2018 I am sorry I should have specified, I am looking for molds to pour soft plastic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anglinarcher Posted January 2, 2018 Report Share Posted January 2, 2018 5 minutes ago, Jl12345 said: I am sorry I should have specified, I am looking for molds to pour soft plastic Open pour or inject? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jl12345 Posted January 2, 2018 Author Report Share Posted January 2, 2018 I actually would like injection but it seems open pour is easier Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anglinarcher Posted January 2, 2018 Report Share Posted January 2, 2018 2 hours ago, Anglinarcher said: Silicone is a great option for this, and Alumilite HS2 Let's go with this one then. The following are some links that can help you out. http://www.makelure.com/store/pg/54-How-To-Videos.aspx http://www.makelure.com/store/pg/54-How-To-Videos.aspx#prettyPhoto/61/ If you want to go injection in the future, check this out. http://www.makelure.com/store/pg/54-How-To-Videos.aspx#prettyPhoto/43/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark poulson Posted January 3, 2018 Report Share Posted January 3, 2018 I have been able to make lots of two part injection molds with POP. I typically make matching shallow mold boxes with 1X borders and 1/4 plywood backs, so they aren't as fragile. I line the inside of the boxes with fiberglass drywall tape, and add some brads in the inside face of the 1X border to act as a holding key. I also add some yellow carpenter's glue to the POP, once it's mixed, and that helps keep details sharp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Travis Posted January 3, 2018 Report Share Posted January 3, 2018 (edited) Making a mold isn't hard to do just takes a little patience and thought. Much of the results however are dependent up on t he guy/gal making the mold. For the average DIY guy I think POP is about the cheapest, easiest to source material that will give very good results. I used POP for a lot of molds initially and poured a lot of lures out of POP molds. At a few dollars for several multiple cavity molds and ease of making very hard to beat. I switched to Durham's Rock Hard Puddy (yellowish molds below) rather quickly however and find it suits my needs better in regards to detail longevity, takes rough handling better, but still needs sealing. Can chuck a few other "similar" products like dental molding materials and art/sculpture products like Permastone. A mold release agent is nice to use and guys use an assortment of waxes, oils, greases. PAM (vegetable spray), Johnson's Paste wax, Vasololine, etc... all get used but products designed for use are easier to use and typically cause less issues with sealing a mold later down the road. Mann's Ease release is cheap enough and gives excellent results. I still usually wipe down and clean the molds with a solvent prior to sealing. Typically on water based molding material little issue and doesn't get absorbed. As mentioned prior undercuts are important in regards to initial molding of master as easy to get it locked into place if a hard master. I seal POP molds with thinned Devcon. I use no additives, backing, through rods, fiberglass reinforcement, no need for special baking procedures, etc. I think lure makers have a tendency to take something very simple and up the making it very involved and complicated for some reason (assume stems from the concept of making a better mouse trap.) Many threads touch on theses subjects but honestly never found the methods employed any added benefit but search the threads or ask away if any questions. I stack my molds in Rubbermaid containers and stuff them on a shelf when not in use. A few may have chipped over the years but still going strong. At one time I had about 10 totes using the careful storage method below . I have used Bondo body filler also for quick molds both one piece and two piece. Gets you a mold very quickly for testing and fills in nicely in a pinch. The issue they get warm quick and without reinforcement start to warp and bend. I don't mess with these too often but is nice at times. Have used fiberglass resin also and found it to pick up detail better, but still issues with heat. Were several threads over the years on this and tricks, but my least favorite molds overall. Have made two piece stick baits and a lot of simple french fry style lures with bondo and just use a router bit on the drill press and x/y sled and "mill" them. Nothing fancy but works just fine. Both POP and Durham's are nice as they initially will let baits set up quicker but this can also be a downfall in thin wall appendages/tails and you start to get incomplete fills. Now in bulky lures it helps to cool down quicker but still takes a while. The same bait in RTV silicone takes much longer to cool but you can get the benefits of pouring a little cooler and getting thin appendages to fill. Just much depends on the bait. Had a guy that wanted a commercially available frog bait done in soft plastic. I went with RTV for it in order to get the legs to fill completely as cooled to quick in POP molds. Now the mud dog lure takes way to long to cool in RTV (bad enough in POP) so one has to have a lot of cavities or it goes very slow. RTV silicone molds shine in regards to hard masters. If the master is a hard material with undercuts then RTV is what I will switch to. The eye sockets in the shad below. I have molded hard masters with undercuts in silicone to then make "master" soft plastics to make molds from cheaper materials. I haven't used the aluminum resin stuff mentioned by Anglinarcher but is one that interests me if some of the quick cooling properties of aluminum molds are shared. Overall have used resin products the least typically because of cost and was routinely getting open pour aluminum molds for sub 20 bucks on ebay. Many of my molds I replaced with aluminum molds of similar design over the years as they became available and if I had fewer hobbies would likely get into making my own. Edited January 3, 2018 by Travis 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anglinarcher Posted January 3, 2018 Report Share Posted January 3, 2018 On 1/2/2018 at 9:49 AM, Jl12345 said: I am looking to make a few molds and I am wondering what is the best material to make them out of POP, Resin , etc. Thank You I sure hope you are ready for this. LOL 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jl12345 Posted January 3, 2018 Author Report Share Posted January 3, 2018 I am ready to learn all I can but something tells me its just something else to spend money on LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsworms Posted January 3, 2018 Report Share Posted January 3, 2018 58 minutes ago, Jl12345 said: I am ready to learn all I can but something tells me its just something else to spend money on LOL My bank account was never fond of me making baits. LOL 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anglinarcher Posted January 3, 2018 Report Share Posted January 3, 2018 ROFLOL I love to make lures, but I still buy lures as well. I tell people that is is tough to save money on lures by making them yourself. It can be done, but you need to be very disciplined and not buy anymore items them you absolutely need. If you can buy what you want, making them yourself seldom makes "Cents". On the other hand, I make lures to provide myself with something I cannot get over the counter or by ordering it. For example, the Mudpuppy Travis shows is awesome and I would consider making that myself, but now I see I can contact Travis to try and buy one. Hehe Travis, be prepared this spring. Travis talks about $20 aluminum molds on Ebay. If they are what you want, and you are happy with them, get them and don't make your own. Ebay, or Craigslist, or ..... can be a great way to save some money. But, if you cannot find what you want, especially for a less expensive price, then making them is your only option. I have some soft plastic swimbaits that are on the smallish side, something I could not get over the counter or off line, so I made my own Silicone molds (RTV - Room Temperature Vulcanization). For me, getting what I wanted was more important than the fact that the cost of the mold material, the plastisol, the colorants, the glitters, etc., could never be recovered. After all, I might use 20 or 30 in the next few years but I could make hundreds from the material I bought. Ugggg On the other hand, I think I have a new design I want to try, I better go out and buy some more stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saugerman Posted January 4, 2018 Report Share Posted January 4, 2018 I have made several molds from the Durhams Rock Hard Putty. I bought mine in a large card board barrel, that I ordered from our local farm store. It figured out to be about .75 a pound. That was about 3 years a go's price, haven't bought any lately. But it is stronger and for me a little easier to work with, than pop. If you give it time to dry and seal it, you can make some pretty nice injection molds with it. It's like anything else, it takes practice . But you will get better with each mold you make. I think it's a good , inexpensive way to start. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jl12345 Posted January 4, 2018 Author Report Share Posted January 4, 2018 Thanks Guys for all the help, I know it cannot be an exact replica due to Patent but does anyone know of a good mold out there that is a Gene Larew Salt craw in the 4",5" and the 6" ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apdriver Posted January 4, 2018 Report Share Posted January 4, 2018 5 hours ago, Jl12345 said: Thanks Guys for all the help, I know it cannot be an exact replica due to Patent but does anyone know of a good mold out there that is a Gene Larew Salt craw in the 4",5" and the 6" ? Do it has a couple of similar craws, though not exact. Theirs have legs but they pull off easy. The slim daddy might be the closest, body wise. The icraw has a little fatter body than the salt craw but has those realistic claws. Bass tackle has a 731 and 733 that looks similar, also. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baitjunkys Posted January 4, 2018 Report Share Posted January 4, 2018 Are you sure that craw has a patent on it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baitjunkys Posted January 4, 2018 Report Share Posted January 4, 2018 well since its 30yrs old any patent is expired now anyhow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jl12345 Posted January 4, 2018 Author Report Share Posted January 4, 2018 I am not sure at all it has a patent , I was just assuming Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark poulson Posted January 4, 2018 Report Share Posted January 4, 2018 I don't think it's okay to knock off a patented commercial product, and then try to sell it. To me, that's stealing. I've made a lot of POP molds of commercial soft plastics, but I don't sell baits so I don't worry about patents. I just pour for myself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jl12345 Posted January 4, 2018 Author Report Share Posted January 4, 2018 I agree Mark. I dont plan on selling them just using them and I actually wish I could find a mold I could buy I am sure it would be a lot better mold than I could make lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baitjunkys Posted January 4, 2018 Report Share Posted January 4, 2018 (edited) 36 minutes ago, mark poulson said: I don't think it's okay to knock off a patented commercial product, and then try to sell it. To me, that's stealing. I've made a lot of POP molds of commercial soft plastics, but I don't sell baits so I don't worry about patents. I just pour for myself. If you buy molds, AKA Ukraine, Isn't that promoting stealing? Just asking. Edited January 4, 2018 by Baitjunkys Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Travis Posted January 5, 2018 Report Share Posted January 5, 2018 15 hours ago, Jl12345 said: Thanks Guys for all the help, I know it cannot be an exact replica due to Patent but does anyone know of a good mold out there that is a Gene Larew Salt craw in the 4",5" and the 6" ? There were a few floating around for a while years ago that were very similar to the 4 inch. At one point I was buying 100 count bags of Larew Salt craws for 8 to 12 bucks direct from them. At one time I had several thousand of them. Scary to think about the numbers of those I went through at one point. Definitely wouldn't be too difficult to mold if you go that route. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark poulson Posted January 5, 2018 Report Share Posted January 5, 2018 16 hours ago, Baitjunkys said: If you buy molds, AKA Ukraine, Isn't that promoting stealing? Just asking. I have bought stone molds from them, and they are similar, but not identical, to the Keitech swimbait. I also bought the Ripper mold from Do-It, which is another Keitech knock off. To me, they are not identical, so I don't think of them as stealing from Keitech. Are the Keitech swimbait designs patented? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baitjunkys Posted January 5, 2018 Report Share Posted January 5, 2018 Just now, mark poulson said: I have bought stone molds from them, and they are similar, but not identical, to the Keitech swimbait. I also bought the Ripper mold from Do-It, which is another Keitech knock off. To me, they are not identical, so I don't think of them as stealing from Keitech. Are the Keitech swimbait designs patented? Just yanking your Chain Mark, the Ukraine is knocking off every Patent bait there is and even selling them using there names. But people are still buying, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark poulson Posted January 5, 2018 Report Share Posted January 5, 2018 Just now, Baitjunkys said: Just yanking your Chain Mark, the Ukraine is knocking off every Patent bait there is and even selling them using there names. But people are still buying, Nah nah, nah nah, nah nah! Hahaha I would have made a POP mold of the Keitech Fat Impact if I thought I could make a usable mold. Filling all those ribs with POP would be a nightmare, and I'm pretty sure those rib fins in the mold would be really fragile, no matter how much glue I add to the POP. So I bought the knockoffs, and they make good baits. In fact, I think the Ripper, which is a little fatter than the Fat Impact, is a better bait, with more meat in the body for rigging, and a more deep belly/shad-like shape. And it pours great with your medium plastic! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
