IronBass Posted November 8, 2018 Report Share Posted November 8, 2018 Can anyone give me any insight about this type of heat exchanger. The gal in the video calls it a "cooker" at the about the 7 minute mark. What I would be interested in knowing some options for this type of system. I'm not really interested in the injection part. Want to know about the pump pulling the plastic, how to disperse the plastic from the "cooker" and the "cooker" itself. With crap loads of searches in the past all I came up was with very expensive options and really not even knowing if they are like the system in the video. The only one I have ever seen in person looked just like the one in the video, but the user had a small wand and they would pump 4 to 8 oz. of plastisol into a pyrex cup and hand pour or hand inject. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baitjunkys Posted November 12, 2018 Report Share Posted November 12, 2018 (edited) Simple premise. Pump it in, it holds enough volume generally half of the volume is cooked and ready to go as new comes in. New one is gonna cost you 1500 to 2000.00. For the cooker alone. You still need controls. Problem with a pyrex, you got to use it, or you will burn it up quickly. Awesome thing about a heat exchanger is a guy could use lureworks suspendasol thru it all day long. Limiting the mixing. I have built hose machines, our original design was to be dispensed into pyrex cups. If you really wanted one, it could be done. Edited November 12, 2018 by Baitjunkys 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elf Posted November 12, 2018 Report Share Posted November 12, 2018 I've worked in plastic companies before and that is a plastic injection molding machine that is (looking at the size of it) capable of maybe a couple hundred tons of pressure. Forty-six cavity mold opening/closing every minute and a half....I can only dream of production capability like that. As far as the "cooker" goes? I have no idea... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baitjunkys Posted November 12, 2018 Report Share Posted November 12, 2018 actually most worm machines average between 2 tons of clamp force to 15 tons of clamp force. Cavities range from avg of 16 to 80 on bass lures and 30 to 250 on crappie lures, Lot of variables in that mix. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elf Posted November 12, 2018 Report Share Posted November 12, 2018 Yes, there are a ton of different variables including type and temp of plastic being shot, but generally speaking, the bigger the molds the more force required to hold them together during the injection process. I suspect that applies to one degree or another with plastisol and it's variants as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elf Posted November 12, 2018 Report Share Posted November 12, 2018 On 11/8/2018 at 12:40 PM, IronBass said: Can anyone give me any insight about this type of heat exchanger. The gal in the video calls it a "cooker" at the about the 7 minute mark. What I would be interested in knowing some options for this type of system. I'm not really interested in the injection part. Want to know about the pump pulling the plastic, how to disperse the plastic from the "cooker" and the "cooker" itself. With crap loads of searches in the past all I came up was with very expensive options and really not even knowing if they are like the system in the video. The only one I have ever seen in person looked just like the one in the video, but the user had a small wand and they would pump 4 to 8 oz. of plastisol into a pyrex cup and hand pour or hand inject. What exactly are you trying to do? That might help us help you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronBass Posted November 13, 2018 Author Report Share Posted November 13, 2018 5 hours ago, Elf said: What exactly are you trying to do? That might help us help you. The idea if possible would be to get cooked pastisol on demand for production. It would be for hand pours or possible Jacobs Press. I seen it done, by a company that pours large swimbaits. I just didn't really ask any questions about it since I was a guest in their facility, Thanks for the responses. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elf Posted November 13, 2018 Report Share Posted November 13, 2018 45 minutes ago, IronBass said: The idea if possible would be to get cooked pastisol on demand for production. Yes please! If you figure this out let us know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveMc1 Posted November 13, 2018 Report Share Posted November 13, 2018 53 minutes ago, IronBass said: The idea if possible would be to get cooked pastisol on demand for production. It would be for hand pours or possible Jacobs Press. I seen it done, by a company that pours large swimbaits. I just didn't really ask any questions about it since I was a guest in their facility, Thanks for the responses. As Leonard (Baitjunkys) posted, the problem is the plastic can't sit in the cooker to long or you will burn it up. You will need to be able to pump out about half the volume of the cooker every few minutes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark poulson Posted November 14, 2018 Report Share Posted November 14, 2018 On 11/12/2018 at 9:37 AM, Baitjunkys said: actually most worm machines average between 2 tons of clamp force to 15 tons of clamp force. Cavities range from avg of 16 to 80 on bass lures and 30 to 250 on crappie lures, Lot of variables in that mix. Are those big molds water cooled, so they can be poured again more quickly? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baitjunkys Posted November 14, 2018 Report Share Posted November 14, 2018 1 hour ago, mark poulson said: Are those big molds water cooled, so they can be poured again more quickly? Yes.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark poulson Posted November 15, 2018 Report Share Posted November 15, 2018 19 hours ago, Baitjunkys said: Yes.. Makes sense. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saugerman Posted November 17, 2018 Report Share Posted November 17, 2018 Iron Bass, thanks for sharing that video. I really enjoyed watching it. I always wondered how the big companies made there baits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronBass Posted November 17, 2018 Author Report Share Posted November 17, 2018 (edited) On November 12, 2018 at 8:51 PM, DaveMc1 said: As Leonard (Baitjunkys) posted, the problem is the plastic can't sit in the cooker to long or you will burn it up. You will need to be able to pump out about half the volume of the cooker every few minutes. I understand, but could it not be configured so I pump out of 55 gallon as I need it heated. Lets say, I'm heating 4 ounces at a time in the heat exchanger and pouring one of my 10 molds that take 4 ounce shots. Can I not just turn off the pump that pumps plastisol to the exchanger, do my business and then turn the pump back on when I want to start cooking plastisol again?? Edited November 17, 2018 by IronBass spelling Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baitjunkys Posted November 17, 2018 Report Share Posted November 17, 2018 I sure wish it was that easy, I really do. Heat exchangers do not cool or heat instantly. Typically it holds 2x the amount used. If you used 4 ounces you would need to do so every 2 minutes or so, or what is left will just burn up. Yes even the no scorch stuff people claim will burn up to. And unless you color the whole barrel, what goes into the heat exchanger is colored and glitter while in its raw form. It is very doable, with a 1 pound heat exchanger its sure can be done, just not as simplistic as most people want nor there idea of cost wants. I can pretty much promise you to buy this setup all ready to dispense, your gonna spend minimum of 4000.00... Building it yourself is doable as well if you can get anyone to share there knowledge with you. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronBass Posted November 17, 2018 Author Report Share Posted November 17, 2018 (edited) 13 minutes ago, Baitjunkys said: I sure wish it was that easy, I really do. Heat exchangers do not cool or heat instantly. Typically it holds 2x the amount used. If you used 4 ounces you would need to do so every 2 minutes or so, or what is left will just burn up. Yes even the no scorch stuff people claim will burn up to. And unless you color the whole barrel, what goes into the heat exchanger is colored and glitter while in its raw form. It is very doable, with a 1 pound heat exchanger its sure can be done, just not as simplistic as most people want nor there idea of cost wants. I can pretty much promise you to buy this setup all ready to dispense, your gonna spend minimum of 4000.00... Building it yourself is doable as well if you can get anyone to share there knowledge with you. Thanks, this is the type of advice I have been seeking. Edited November 17, 2018 by IronBass Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elf Posted November 17, 2018 Report Share Posted November 17, 2018 9 minutes ago, Baitjunkys said: I sure wish it was that easy, I really do. Heat exchangers do not cool or heat instantly. Typically it holds 2x the amount used. If you used 4 ounces you would need to do so every 2 minutes or so, or what is left will just burn up. Yes even the no scorch stuff people claim will burn up to. And unless you color the whole barrel, what goes into the heat exchanger is colored and glitter while in its raw form. It is very doable, with a 1 pound heat exchanger its sure can be done, just not as simplistic as most people want nor there idea of cost wants. I can pretty much promise you to buy this setup all ready to dispense, your gonna spend minimum of 4000.00... Building it yourself is doable as well if you can get anyone to share there knowledge with you. Just to clarify, the plastisol is only being heated to a certain temp and it's still burning? Why? People leave heated plastisol in measuring cups on hot trays to keep it at temperature. What is different about the heat exchanger that causes it to burn the plastisol? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baitjunkys Posted November 17, 2018 Report Share Posted November 17, 2018 I don't really have time to explain heating principles, A measuring cup on a hot tray is not even close to the same tho. Pour some plastic on your hot plate and let it set, this is more realistic to how a heat exchanger works. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elf Posted November 17, 2018 Report Share Posted November 17, 2018 9 minutes ago, Baitjunkys said: I don't really have time to explain heating principles Try me. I'm probably a bit smarter than you think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elf Posted November 17, 2018 Report Share Posted November 17, 2018 There is obviously some difference between the two. Does the glass between the heat source and the plastisol make the difference? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elf Posted November 18, 2018 Report Share Posted November 18, 2018 (edited) I had some things to do but I've had a bit of time to do some reading now. (I have heat in my garage now!!) @IronBass, I think I have a partial answer for you in layman's terms. A heat exchanger provides a means of transferring heat from one liquid to another. In order for you to heat your plastisol quickly your primary heat source has to be hotter than the temp you are heating your plastisol to, because of that if you leave the plastisol in the heat exchanger too long it overheats and burns. Theoretically you could bring the plastisol up to temperature more slowly but in order for the heat exchanger to be useful you would still likely burn a lot of plastisol. You don't want it to take longer than your microwave either. The heat exchanger is also costing you money just sitting there as long as it's on and it's only likely to be useful if you are doing lots of production. It probably takes a lot of energy to keep the liquid hot enough to heat plastisol to 300+ in such a short time. If you could fill the HE for a one time shot, heat your plastisol and then empty the HE until you needed it again....I suppose that might be possible but I suspect if it was someone else would have already done it. *Edit* Oops....here's one of the articles I read on heat exchangers https://www.brighthubengineering.com/hvac/59900-fundamentals-of-heat-exchanger-theory-and-design/. Edited November 18, 2018 by Elf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elf Posted November 18, 2018 Report Share Posted November 18, 2018 @IronBasss if you want to read more on heat exchangers here's a search result for you. https://www.bing.com/search?q=heat+exchanger+design&FORM=R5FD1 Good luck on whatever you decide. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saratovfishing Posted November 21, 2018 Report Share Posted November 21, 2018 @Baitjunkys How can I contact you about buying such a heat exchanger? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elf Posted November 24, 2018 Report Share Posted November 24, 2018 (edited) On 11/21/2018 at 11:08 AM, saratovfishing said: @Baitjunkys How can I contact you about buying such a heat exchanger? You could try www.baitjunkys.com and reach out to them there. Just double checked to be sure, click the "contact us" button at the top of the page and then fill out the form. Should be good to go. Edited November 24, 2018 by Elf 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt crawford Posted October 22, 2019 Report Share Posted October 22, 2019 I can offer some insight to this, as I work for this company. Here is how it works in a nut shell. The raw plastic is sucked up into the cylinder, and pumped into the "cooker". Depending on the shot weight of the mold, for example, this mold has a shot weight of 1.6lbs of plastic per shot. So, we use a "cooker" that has a total volume of 4.5 lbs. Here is the reason why, after it injects the mold with 1.6 lbs of plastic, it needs a "recover time". This allows for the 1.6 lbs that was taken out to be reheated to around 350 degrees. You would think a 3 lbs, double the weight, would do the trick, but this mold opens roughly every two minutes, so a bigger heat exchanger is required to actually bring the room temp plastic to 350 degrees. The pressure and temperature are set according to the mold size, total cavities, and believe it or not, color.some colors, especially red, tend to run hotter that say a white. I still havent figured that one out and I've been here at southern plastics for 6 years now. Also, the salt and glitter content will give you fits at times as well. These exchangers are pretty basic in design. It has an inlet, and an outlet, the plastic goes in and runs thru channels inside the exchanger which has between 4 and 6 heating elements depending on the size, and out the outlet, thru the nozzle and into the mold. Pretty basic, but gets the job done. Hope this helps. 2 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
