ravenlures Posted May 2, 2019 Report Share Posted May 2, 2019 If a 1 lb ball falls 4ft how much does it weigh or how much pull on a line. Want to test a lure hanger out. Wayne This should be for Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benton B Posted May 2, 2019 Report Share Posted May 2, 2019 That is a good physics question, I would just a hang 20 lb weight and see what happens 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodkaman Posted May 2, 2019 Report Share Posted May 2, 2019 A very interesting question, but with no answer as there is an unknown. The weight dropping a distance influenced by gravity seems like a simple equation. In fact it is, BUT, it only gives you the energy (potential energy). The actual force experienced at the bottom of the drop is totally dependent on the elasticity of the line. Mono, having more 'give' will experience a lesser force than say braid or one of the modern thin lines that have less elasticity. The elasticity absorbs the energy generated by the free fall. A line made of elastic bands with huge elasticity will experience a much smaller 'load' than say a line with zero elasticity. I went through this exact process when I was designing a lure testing rig. I abandoned the drop test idea and went for a static load test. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodkaman Posted May 2, 2019 Report Share Posted May 2, 2019 Another problem that I had a year ago when I started fishing after a long absence. This also serves as a loose analogy. I was losing a lot of BIG fish on the strike. There are a lot of big fish, the pond record is 5.72Kg (12.5Lb) caught by me The problem was exasperated by the deep body profile of the bawal fish which provides resistance to the strike force. A smaller fish or a narrow body fish would be jerked through the water, effectively adding to the elasticity of the line and the 'give' of the rod. I was using 30Lb mono line and a carbon rod designed for big fish, so it was a tad stiff. Obviously I was hitting the fish too hard. I tried to correct this fault of mine, but in the heat of the moment instinct would take over and the line would snap. The analogy is that my strike was the equivalent of gravity only much higher. The fish was the weight, and the elasticity was a combination of the mono, rod flex and the jerk of the fish. The fish weight was fixed, I did not want to go higher in line thickness, I could not control the strike acceleration (gravity), so the only variable left was rod stiffness. So, I built a rod from a fiberglass blank intended for smaller fish. The rod flexed passed double, but I started catching more BIG fish. The problem was solved, and that's engineering Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ravenlures Posted May 2, 2019 Author Report Share Posted May 2, 2019 Dave slow down I am a old man. Now lets say that there is no stretch in the line on the dropped ball then what would it be at the bottom of the drop, now that's a given right. I am not worried on flex of a rod or stretch of line. Just a straight answer. Wayne Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodkaman Posted May 2, 2019 Report Share Posted May 2, 2019 (edited) Wayne - I understand the age thing, feeling it somewhat myself, though you do have 13 years on me Theoretically, the load at the end of the drop with zero flex would be infinite! Of course there is always some flex, which makes the theoretical situation rather silly and incomprehensible. In terms of science, it all comes down to the law of 'conservation of energy'. What this means is that energy cannot be created or destroyed. You do work (input energy) when you raise the ball, you burned calories. When the ball drops the energy has to go somewhere, usually as heat. Your initial question is entirely reasonable, a question that I explored myself. BUT, it just doesn't work like that. If we knew how much the line stretches during the fall, we could actually come up with a number to represent the load. I am not an expert here, this is just my interpretation of the rules. Dave Edited May 2, 2019 by Vodkaman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ravenlures Posted May 2, 2019 Author Report Share Posted May 2, 2019 Dave If you drop a 1lb ball and it hits a surface after a 4ft fall how much does that ball impact the surface in lbs. No line just bang. Wayne Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ravenlures Posted May 2, 2019 Author Report Share Posted May 2, 2019 Dave if you need a line stretch say .500 inches. Wayne Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodkaman Posted May 3, 2019 Report Share Posted May 3, 2019 (edited) The answer is 96Lbs. If you double the stretch then you halve the load: 0.5 = 96Lbs 1.0 = 48Lbs 2.0 = 24Lbs Find a way to measure that momentary stretch and an accurate figure can be calculated. I can send anyone a simple spreadsheet were you can enter your 3 numbers and get the answer. Just pm me your email and I will send. Dave Edited May 3, 2019 by Vodkaman 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ravenlures Posted May 4, 2019 Author Report Share Posted May 4, 2019 Thanks Dave. Wayne 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TroutSupport.com Posted May 5, 2019 Report Share Posted May 5, 2019 What type of fish are you trying to catch may be a better way to look at this.. or are you trying to gear up for casting a pounder and having something go wrong. Even some of the largest freshwater and inshore saltwater fish put less than 10lbs of force on a drag system.. until you start getting into 40lb striped bass or Red Drum and some pelagic species like King mackeral and tuna. Even the extremely sought after spotted sea trout a true 9-10 lb monster only exerts about 12-15 lbs of drag, and the drag is set of less so the line doesn't break. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ravenlures Posted May 5, 2019 Author Report Share Posted May 5, 2019 What I want to do is test out my hook hangars which I will make a twist one instead of a screw eye. It is just for my own peace of mind. 96 lb. pull is pretty good. Its my way of doing things not sure what will happen but will let you know of the results. Again Dave Wayne Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sonoman Posted May 8, 2019 Report Share Posted May 8, 2019 Engineered angler has a video of this on you tube, epoxied twist hangers pulled out at like 160 lbs where superglued ones were much less...def. interesting to say the least. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodkaman Posted May 8, 2019 Report Share Posted May 8, 2019 Barrel twist is the best solution, giving more trapped glue and more 'teeth' to hold. As for testing; I hung a bucket with 20Ltr of water (44Lb) for 24 hours. It held and that was good enough to satisfy me. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hazmail Posted May 10, 2019 Report Share Posted May 10, 2019 (edited) For what it's worth I too have thought some on this, BUT having no knowledge of "Hard" maths (anything above algebra) I would have acquired a set of fish scales (with memory) hung the ball off the scale with something that doesn't stretch much,,Drop the ball and the weight (shock) will be recorded on the scales for you to read ---Just make sure you catch the ball before it drops again as it will probably cancel the last traumatic event. No matter what size ball all results should be relative, as long as the hanger wire remains the same length /thickness and the drop height remains the same. Remember, double the ball diameter is 4 X the mass. I THINK!! Was it ''Newton'' who got hit on the head with an apple ?? As I said I never did get to try this. Pete Edited May 10, 2019 by hazmail Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodkaman Posted May 10, 2019 Report Share Posted May 10, 2019 8x Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ravenlures Posted May 11, 2019 Author Report Share Posted May 11, 2019 I'm glad that this got the mind moving a little on the old guys like me. Now for my nap ……….what was I talking about. Wayne Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark poulson Posted May 12, 2019 Report Share Posted May 12, 2019 I used to worry if my twist wires set in super glue in my PVC baits would hold, until I tried to turn one as the glue was setting. I waited a touch too long. I wound up just twisting the loop, not the whole twist wire. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
