Selling Baits Online (and in general I suppose)

[JD_mudbug]

An interesting thought, but as I mentioned - the lures are otherwise identical, save for paint.  Looking at it from the consumer side, I'm not sure I see how that would be differentiated.  Do you happen to have an example of such a lure?

 

I have purchased an excessive amount of lures through the years. At one point, I had over 10k lures organized in boxes and inventoried on spreadsheets. So hopefully, I can provide a viewpoint as a consumer

I have seen paint price ‘differentials’ numerous times on custom baits as wells some mass produced baits. It doesn’t bother me. Lucky Craft charges a $1-2 differential on some paints schemes in some of their models. If you look at their squarebills and pointers, they charge extra for colors like American shad, crack, impulse shad, flake Rayburn red. Their squarebill is only a $7 lure and that has a $1 upcharge on some colors. The 9” Grandma ($23) has a $7 upcharge for the Viper paint series. Bull Dawgs cost more for the ‘Pro Series’. G2 Shellcrackers ($30) are $5 more for ‘Custom’ colors. You are correct about Suick. Suick has a wounded series that has paint scheme sideways on the bait to look like a fish on its side and another series with holographic foil. TW has some mass produced lures sold in custom colors only available on TW’s website. Sometimes there is a differential on the Suick’s and TW lures, sometimes there isn’t.

People pay money just to have a factory lure or blank custom painted ($15-20 for a 2.5 squarebill in the bass realm). They will pay more in a musky realm to get a color they want unless it is out of line for the price of the lure. When you look at the Lucky Craft American shad color squarebill, it clearly stands apart from their regular paint schemes with those scales. Most tackle consumers in the upper price range can discern the difference of the extra effort.  The number of different colors, scale netting use, blending, stencil work, fine detail work, properly applied foil a/o glitter, and the paint scheme overall appearance are all easy to see on a big lure. I would not pay say $50 extra for a certain paint scheme on a $70 lure as it is close to buying another lure. $15 would not be out of line on a $70 lure. I may even go to $25 if I really like the paint.

I usually find custom lures at fishing shows/expos (when those were open). When I look to buy a lure over $30, I look at construction quality first. I try to find video of the action next. I look for any reviews and fellow anglers experience with the lure. If I am at a show and buying a rod (or any other non-lure product), I will ask that seller if he/she knows about the lure. He/she is already getting money from me and isn’t competing with the lure maker. Color detail may be my last consideration. I paid $75 for a lure with a moderately detailed paint job a couple of years ago. After fishing with it for a year and having success, I bought another one the following year for $80 that was just an all-black paint job.

I don't think the musky baits need to have to a highly detailed paint job to sell. Just look at the Headlocks and other lures at muskyshop.com for the level of detail in the paint schemes. The Headlock lip and the action sell that lure. The design and paint scheme aren’t complex. Just well thought out and well executed to get that action.

I am not saying whether or not you should do a price differential/up charge on paint. I think either way, one price or 2-level pricing, a quality lure will sell. I would not go more than 2 levels. If you want 2 price levels, I would try to stay at or below $20 extra on a $70 bait. And of course, give that series a cool name.

If you want to go with just one price like Hillbilly, simplify your most complex paint jobs. Go for a good level of detail but not ridiculous and see how many of those you can still do with your $70 price tag, or whatever price you can keep the bulk of them at. Keep the basic paint schemes at the same price even if it is less effort for you. That could help make up for a couple that would otherwise be at the higher price level. Maybe even spice up a basic color scheme a bit to make it more comparable to the other schemes. That all black lure could have had red gill line, a red fin, and red belly fading into orange at the tail. It goes from black to ‘night raider’ with not that much effort.

I wish you the best and hope it goes well.

Edited January 25, 2021 by JD_mudbug

[JD_mudbug]

Hopefully, this will make some of you feel better. The following is not legal advice or meant to be political in away.

As for the FET-

It sucks that others cheat the system. Cheating the tax man drives up the rates for everyone else no matter what tax you’re talking about. The tax enforcement right now is lax so more people tend to cheat. Enforcement levels come and go in cycles. Proving a tax case can be rather easy (see Al Capone). If you get caught once, you can be doomed. Generally, there is no statute of limitations if no return is filed or if intent to defraud is established. So, all those years in the past can come into play once you get caught.

All you can do is the right thing. Don't worry about what other people are doing. You see them cheating and get pissed. But, what most people never see or hear is the shit storm that explodes when someone gets caught. I have seen it in my line of work. People tend to get very quiet once they get in that type of trouble. The website goes down. Facebook and social media accounts get deleted. I have seen a person audited on FET. I know someone was who representing a person’s wife on a different but similar tax. The auditors came with screen shots of the husband’s website, photos of his booth at expos, affidavits from customers, bank records, etc. He knew he was screwed. He died of a heart-attack during the audit and left a grieving wife to clean up the mess. Death was his only escape from jail time. I know of another person who used some ‘creative’ record keeping for years. He suddenly vanished. He had quietly taken a plea deal for fraud and served several years. He is on a long probation with travel restrictions and has to pay back massive restitution. Some people that know him still don’t know he was a guest of the feds. All it took was one disgruntled person to report him. The person who reported him was committing the same type of fraud. That person told on numerous people doing the same thing to lighten his own sentence.

Sometimes they do get caught. You just never hear about that. No one posts about their tax evasion conviction on their Facebook page.

 

Edited January 25, 2021 by JD_mudbug

[ravenlures]

I sold my lures at the Musky Show for 30 to 35.00 I also had a hard time selling on ebay for 5.00 so I just stopped and took a look at what and how I was doing my lures. Will come out with some new lures by early summer. Will have two types I will get rid of all my plastic lures which I purchased paint and sell and go back to 6" and bigger 9"   to 12" out of wood which I enjoy and stay away from e-bay and find other means of selling maybe go back to my own web site not sure about face book. I also would like to do flea markets just to talk lure making with the guys. If this virus ever gets over with.

Wayne

[Hillbilly voodoo]

1 hour ago, ravenlures said:

I sold my lures at the Musky Show for 30 to 35.00 I also had a hard time selling on ebay for 5.00 so I just stopped and took a look at what and how I was doing my lures. Will come out with some new lures by early summer. Will have two types I will get rid of all my plastic lures which I purchased paint and sell and go back to 6" and bigger 9"   to 12" out of wood which I enjoy and stay away from e-bay and find other means of selling maybe go back to my own web site not sure about face book. I also would like to do flea markets just to talk lure making with the guys. If this virus ever gets over with.

Wayne

I will also be axing some of my models and replacing them with new ones or tweaking them. The funny thing is the most productive and popular design was one that came to be by reworking a broken master 

My top water (surface paddler)needs some tweaking before I am willing to sell them. Seems to be a little much for pike unless they are 30+inch. It did catch a few musky though but this is not my primary market. 

I have a request to develop a shallower running bait by every tester as well 

Wife is also demanding I build a hybrid hard body soft paddle swimbait 

I swear designing or redesigning never ends 

[exx1976]

1 hour ago, ravenlures said:

I sold my lures at the Musky Show for 30 to 35.00 I also had a hard time selling on ebay for 5.00 so I just stopped and took a look at what and how I was doing my lures. Will come out with some new lures by early summer. Will have two types I will get rid of all my plastic lures which I purchased paint and sell and go back to 6" and bigger 9"   to 12" out of wood which I enjoy and stay away from e-bay and find other means of selling maybe go back to my own web site not sure about face book. I also would like to do flea markets just to talk lure making with the guys. If this virus ever gets over with.

Wayne

$30-35 seems extremely reasonable for a plastic lure. Prior to my angry day on the water where I declared "I can do better!", I had purchased hundreds of plastic musky lures in that price range. To what do you attribute the difficulty in moving product? What kind of feedback did you receive at the musky show? 

 

@JD_MUDBUG - I'll respond to your comment in detail when I get to a computer, but the one model you mention with an aluminum lip and simple paint - that's one that I was referring to. Screw eyes, simple paint, high price. There are many builders that use that same formula, and all are ripe competition. There are several who have already gone after that lure by making a "copy" and selling it cheaper. I don't want to (necessarily) be cheaper, I want to be BETTER. 

[JD_mudbug]

They are definitely ripe for competition. I am not saying the musky lures I see or buy are the best constructed lures. Many aspects of their builds could be improved. Alot of the baits I see were better constructed originally and then went cheap when more of a mass production model was adopted. They just have a good action that catches fish. All that means is the design of the lure is a solid concept for the style of fishing done with the lure and the construction is consistent so you get the same action in each bait.  The screw eyes and lip are straight. Clear coat is even. The paint schemes are good enough to get the job of catching fish done. 

I have occasionally bought lures just to try and make my own version where I didn't know anyone who had one. I may like the profile, action, or some concept(s) in the design, but thought some aspect(s) of the lure could be better. There is usually a lot of room for an existing lure to be improved. At the prices they go for, it would be nice to see wire-through.

Most of the lures out there had a predecessor they borrowed some aspect from. Sometimes I know the name of predecessor and still purchase it. So buying a 'copy' doesn't bother me. The high end market always appreciates a 'better' build, an improvement in a concept, or new twist on an existing idea.  

[ravenlures]

exx1976

I made most out of resin and some cedar. People some liked the cedar and some liked the resin ones so that is part of why I am stepping back now, I will  just take my time at 78 i am not going to think to far down the line my one son shows some interest and my one grandson worked with me.   I just enjoy doing it maybe one big rummage sale late summer and a couple flea markets to sell what I have.  One thing at flea markets some people just want to chew you down and another comes and tells you great work with no chewing down because they say they know what goes into making a lure. Here's a good one I had a lure for 18.00 and a guy comes up and says he will give me ten I told him I already came down from 50 bucks he walked away the next guy comes up and buys two and was very happy. That's the way it goes.

Wayne

[Liv4Nov]

High quality at a fair price is a great approach for your audience.  I would also suggest “Made in the USA” also because it’s the right thing to do and it helps with marketing.

If you’re going to get serious form an LLC or Inc to separate your home life from making lures. Also, stay above board on taxes “excise tax”, books and don’t forget liability insurance.

 
Calculating materials is straight forward for me, but adding overhead is where my head starts to hurt.  This is important when it comes to making a dollar.  

When you have a lure that catches fish, your next step is catching fishermen with it!

[Vodkaman]

Liv4Nov - 'Made in USA' is probably a bit of a stretch. You could probably get away with 'Assembled in USA'.

Dave

[exx1976]

3 hours ago, Vodkaman said:

Liv4Nov - 'Made in USA' is probably a bit of a stretch. You could probably get away with 'Assembled in USA'.

Dave

That depends on the components you're using.  https://www.sgrlaw.com/when-is-it-okay-to-label-my-product-as-made-in-usa/

The only components I'm unsure of are the epoxy and the raw G10 used to craft my lips.

In any event, Liv - I know you're new here, so I'll forgive you for not getting up to speed by reading all the threads, but I already have everything done that you mention.  This isn't my first rodeo.

[Liv4Nov]

5 hours ago, exx1976 said:

 

In any event, Liv - I know you're new here, so I'll forgive you for not getting up to speed by reading all the threads, but I already have everything done that you mention.  This isn't my first rodeo.

Not new, just do not post very often and my comments were not directed towards you.... so need for me to get up to speed!

[Big Epp]

"Handcrafted in the USA?"

[Liv4Nov]

2 hours ago, Big Epp said:

"Handcrafted in the USA?"

Sounds way better than what I suggested.

[Vodkaman]

I guess if I was in the lure business, mine would be labelled 'NOT made in USA'.

Dave

[Liv4Nov]

Or you could say "Handcrafted In Indonesia".... 

Bottom line is quality!!!