Resin clear coat problems

[Lochie]

Hey everybody, I have been struggling finding a good clear coat that doesn’t bubble or create craters. I live in Australia and was wondering what everyone uses? Any advise would be greatly appreciated. Thanks Lochie

[azsouth]

To me it looks like contamination on the paint..... meaning that either you got oil from your hands or something like that on the bait or the paint was not fully dry.

Just my .02

[ravenlures]

I would try thinning your resin 5 to 10%. Do you brush it on or pour it on which I do most of the time depending on the size of the lure. Also look it over when on the lure turner then you can brush the areas needed. If the problem still their then it would most likely be the problem with the paint area.

Wayne

[JD_mudbug]

You can use the search feature at the top right or under the ‘Activity’ button to look up clear coat posts.  There are a lot of posts with lots of tips. Which ones have you tried already? I have used Devcon 2 Ton (D2T), Envirotex Lite (Etex), and Bob Smith Industries (BSI) and they all can work well. They all can also have issues if not used correctly. Avoid 5 minute epoxies for clear coats as they tend to yellow and can cure too quickly to level out.  Look for ones with a 30 minute or longer working time. I mostly use D2T now because it is readily available where I am and it seems to be tolerant of environmental factors. Everybody has their own preference. I plan on trying Crystal Clear Epoxy from East Coast resins in the near future. Someday, I will get around to building a UV resin curing light box and try that.

Your picture of craters is also called ‘fish eyes’. That term should help in your searches. As others have pointed out, the most common causes of this are surface contamination, missing spots when applying, and not using the clear coat properly.

Surface contamination can occur from touching the bait with your fingers and leaving oils on the paint, the paint not being fully dry, or dust settling on the lure after painting. Try to not to touch the bait and use disposable gloves. You may want to try a spray mid-coat like Rustoleum 2X Clear Matte or Krylon Matte Clear if the problem continues. Do your sanding in another room or outside to avoid dust. Sweep or shop-vac when you have no painting or clear coating planned.  Use a heat gun or hair dryer to set the paint and also to blow off any dust just before clear coating.  You may want to let the paint dry overnight. It is also possible the sealer or paint you used is still off-gassing. Off-gassing usually produces blisters or areas where the clear coat and paint peel off, and not craters. Another problem could be that the paint itself does not allow good adhesion even when dry. Some metallic paints in particular can have this problem. This problem can be solved by spraying a clear mid-coat before the final clear coat.

Missing spots or applying the epoxy too thin will create fish eyes. Your fish eyes appear along the back ridge of that lure. You may have missed that area with the epoxy or put it on too thin. On thicker epoxies, you could thin the epoxy with a couple of drops of denatured alcohol to make it easier to apply. Missing spots was a problem I had before I got a bright light to look over the bait closely. You need to get real close to the bait and may want to use a magnifying glass. Right after applying the clear coat, rotate the bait under a bright light to look for bare spots or uneven clear coat. Look at the glare from the light on the surface of the bait. Deviations or wavy-ness in the glare mean missing or thin epoxy. Pay particular attention to around the hook hangers, line tie, diving bill, any corners or ridges like a gill plate or fin ridge, any sharp curves like the back and belly of the lure. Look for areas that would block a clean brush stroke when applying the clear.

You may be mixing the epoxy in too big of a batch, trying to do too many baits at once. The epoxy could be setting up while you are applying it. It does not have time to level out on the bait. You may have to do smaller batches. On my large baits,  7+ inches and 3+ oz., I do one bait at a time.

Make sure you follow the instructions of the clear coat you are using. Mix the correct ratio. You may need a digital scale for this or disposable measuring cups.  After using D2T for so long, I am able to eyeball this. Try mixing with a plastic stick as opposed to wood.  I use disposable paint brushes to apply my clear. I cut off half of the plastic handle for use as a mixing stick. Don’t mix on a surface that can add contamination. Mix thoroughly. Find the temperature and humidity information for the clear coat on the package or their website. Most clear coats have a preferred temperature and humidity. You may need AC, heat, a humidifier, or dehumidifier if you are not close to the optimal temp and humidity. You may want to warm the bottles in a bowl of warm water before mixing if they are stored below the optimal temperature. Try to avoid clearing on rainy or high humidity days.

If you are using a rotisserie to cure the baits, make sure the baits are not rocking as they rotate. This can happen with larger lures. You may need a 3^rd point to secure the bait from the belly hanger to keep it from rocking. You want the bait to not move on the rotisserie as the rotisserie spins. Big baits have a tendency to flip on the rotisserie if only secured at the two ends. Rocking or flipping can prevent the epoxy for leveling out.

I don’t know what clear coats you have available in Australia. There has to some that will work well if the instructions are followed carefully. It may seem like a pain to pay attention to the proper procedures. But once you get used to it, it becomes second nature. Below are some other posts on clear coats.

Jim

https://www.tackleunderground.com/community/topic/37686-tacky-epoxy-check-your-temps/

https://www.tackleunderground.com/community/topic/37532-new-guy-old-questions/

https://www.tackleunderground.com/community/topic/12510-trying-to-achieve-a-flawless-finish/

https://www.tackleunderground.com/community/topic/36877-epoxy-issues-and-lure-turner-questions/?tab=comments#comment-301056

 

 

 

[Lochie]

9 hours ago, ravenlures said:

I would try thinning your resin 5 to 10%. Do you brush it on or pour it on which I do most of the time depending on the size of the lure. Also look it over when on the lure turner then you can brush the areas needed. If the problem still their then it would most likely be the problem with the paint area.

Wayne

I brush my clear coat on

[Lochie]

6 hours ago, JD_mudbug said:

You can use the search feature at the top right or under the ‘Activity’ button to look up clear coat posts.  There are a lot of posts with lots of tips. Which ones have you tried already? I have used Devcon 2 Ton (D2T), Envirotex Lite (Etex), and Bob Smith Industries (BSI) and they all can work well. They all can also have issues if not used correctly. Avoid 5 minute epoxies for clear coats as they tend to yellow and can cure too quickly to level out.  Look for ones with a 30 minute or longer working time. I mostly use D2T now because it is readily available where I am and it seems to be tolerant of environmental factors. Everybody has their own preference. I plan on trying Crystal Clear Epoxy from East Coast resins in the near future. Someday, I will get around to building a UV resin curing light box and try that.

Your picture of craters is also called ‘fish eyes’. That term should help in your searches. As others have pointed out, the most common causes of this are surface contamination, missing spots when applying, and not using the clear coat properly.

Surface contamination can occur from touching the bait with your fingers and leaving oils on the paint, the paint not being fully dry, or dust settling on the lure after painting. Try to not to touch the bait and use disposable gloves. You may want to try a spray mid-coat like Rustoleum 2X Clear Matte or Krylon Matte Clear if the problem continues. Do your sanding in another room or outside to avoid dust. Sweep or shop-vac when you have no painting or clear coating planned.  Use a heat gun or hair dryer to set the paint and also to blow off any dust just before clear coating.  You may want to let the paint dry overnight. It is also possible the sealer or paint you used is still off-gassing. Off-gassing usually produces blisters or areas where the clear coat and paint peel off, and not craters. Another problem could be that the paint itself does not allow good adhesion even when dry. Some metallic paints in particular can have this problem. This problem can be solved by spraying a clear mid-coat before the final clear coat.

Missing spots or applying the epoxy too thin will create fish eyes. Your fish eyes appear along the back ridge of that lure. You may have missed that area with the epoxy or put it on too thin. On thicker epoxies, you could thin the epoxy with a couple of drops of denatured alcohol to make it easier to apply. Missing spots was a problem I had before I got a bright light to look over the bait closely. You need to get real close to the bait and may want to use a magnifying glass. Right after applying the clear coat, rotate the bait under a bright light to look for bare spots or uneven clear coat. Look at the glare from the light on the surface of the bait. Deviations or wavy-ness in the glare mean missing or thin epoxy. Pay particular attention to around the hook hangers, line tie, diving bill, any corners or ridges like a gill plate or fin ridge, any sharp curves like the back and belly of the lure. Look for areas that would block a clean brush stroke when applying the clear.

You may be mixing the epoxy in too big of a batch, trying to do too many baits at once. The epoxy could be setting up while you are applying it. It does not have time to level out on the bait. You may have to do smaller batches. On my large baits,  7+ inches and 3+ oz., I do one bait at a time.

Make sure you follow the instructions of the clear coat you are using. Mix the correct ratio. You may need a digital scale for this or disposable measuring cups.  After using D2T for so long, I am able to eyeball this. Try mixing with a plastic stick as opposed to wood.  I use disposable paint brushes to apply my clear. I cut off half of the plastic handle for use as a mixing stick. Don’t mix on a surface that can add contamination. Mix thoroughly. Find the temperature and humidity information for the clear coat on the package or their website. Most clear coats have a preferred temperature and humidity. You may need AC, heat, a humidifier, or dehumidifier if you are not close to the optimal temp and humidity. You may want to warm the bottles in a bowl of warm water before mixing if they are stored below the optimal temperature. Try to avoid clearing on rainy or high humidity days.

If you are using a rotisserie to cure the baits, make sure the baits are not rocking as they rotate. This can happen with larger lures. You may need a 3^rd point to secure the bait from the belly hanger to keep it from rocking. You want the bait to not move on the rotisserie as the rotisserie spins. Big baits have a tendency to flip on the rotisserie if only secured at the two ends. Rocking or flipping can prevent the epoxy for leveling out.

I don’t know what clear coats you have available in Australia. There has to some that will work well if the instructions are followed carefully. It may seem like a pain to pay attention to the proper procedures. But once you get used to it, it becomes second nature. Below are some other posts on clear coats.

Jim

https://www.tackleunderground.com/community/topic/37686-tacky-epoxy-check-your-temps/

https://www.tackleunderground.com/community/topic/37532-new-guy-old-questions/

https://www.tackleunderground.com/community/topic/12510-trying-to-achieve-a-flawless-finish/

https://www.tackleunderground.com/community/topic/36877-epoxy-issues-and-lure-turner-questions/?tab=comments#comment-301056

 

 

 

Cheers for all the information, everytime I mix my clear coat I wait about 30-40 minutes just to let it thicken a little bit. So maybe it’s to thick by that point and doesn’t have time to self level. Before I apply the last clear coat I’ll give them a light scuff over and leave the resin to sit for 15-20 minutes and see how that goes. I have been using gloves when painting so I don’t think it would be that. I should clean out my spraying booth and see how that goes too. 

Thanks again

[Lochie]

10 hours ago, azsouth said:

To me it looks like contamination on the paint..... meaning that either you got oil from your hands or something like that on the bait or the paint was not fully dry.

Just my .02

The paint has been left to dry for about 45 minutes so it might be contamination

[ravenlures]

What type of paint if Createx than you must use a hair dryer on them after you paint each color , 45 min might not be good enough in damp or humid conditions.

Wayne

[Lochie]

11 hours ago, ravenlures said:

What type of paint if Createx than you must use a hair dryer on them after you paint each color , 45 min might not be good enough in damp or humid conditions.

Wayne

Thanks, I do use Createx paint. Everytime when I finish with a colour I just spray plain air from the airbrush to dry the paint, but I good idea using a heat gun when in the wet season.

[mark poulson]

13 minutes ago, Lochie said:

Thanks, I do use Createx paint. Everytime when I finish with a colour I just spray plain air from the airbrush to dry the paint, but I good idea using a heat gun when in the wet season.

Using a hair dryer, instead of a heat gun, is much safer.  With a heat gun, if you snooze, you lose.  The paint scheme is ruined, and sometimes the bait, too.

[ravenlures]

Mark

Ditto that.

[Vodkaman]

As I understand things, Createx is a T-shirt type paint and must be heat treated to fix it. Blowing to touch dry is simply not enough. You MUST fix with a hair dryer.

Dave

[Travis]

 After 17 years of using Createx and various other paints never have used a hair dryer as part of the routine.   About the only time I have found a hair dryer useful is painting a single lure, in a hurry, and wanting to use tulle for scale detail.     

[Lochie]

Hey everybody, just replying on this topic. I recently purchased some new clear coat as I have been struggling finding a good clear coat. The new stuff is automotive 2k resin and is meant to be used out of a spray gun, but I use my airbrush. When I spray the resin on the lures it becomes very orange peely. I am just wondering what is causing this and is there any possible way to fix this. I hope it can be fixed as it was expensive, $160 AUS for 1.75L. 

Thanks for any replies.

[AZ Fisher]

 I know you're using an AB, but I thought some of this might help.

 I use a similar 2K auto clear, but I don't use an air brush. I use the spray gun.

 I had some orange peel issues when I started using the HVLP spray gun. It was pretty much a matter of getting the atomization of the droplets to the right consistency and the orange peel was minimized. This is easier with the HVLP gun than an AB IMHO. 

 Can we press down and pull back exactly the same,  each time with an air brush?  The trigger on the HVLP gun is pretty much on/off, not like an AB with the pressure increasing as you pull  back the trigger. Easier to maintain consistent air pressure/clear volume @ 29psi for correct atomization. 

  I also found that putting a very, very light tack coat on first and letting it flash off for 15 min before applying the second coat helped also.  After the 15 min flash off time, I will apply a heavier 2nd coat followed by 15 min of flash off and then a 3rd coat quite heavy. Depending on what bait I'm clearing, maybe a 4th and 5th coat.

 I have about one of the cheapest HVLP guns available but I can still get great results with it. I use the small  hobby gun pictured here. https://www.harborfreight.com/professional-automotive-hvlp-spray-gun-kit-94572.html 

I like having a pressure regulator inline just before the gun helped get me dialed in on maintaining the right consistent air pressure  @29psi . Should you go this route with an HVLP gun, and clearing a higher volume of baits, an airbrush compressor even with a tank won't be able to supply a large enough volume of air consistently without waiting for the comp to catch up. 

 Hope some of this helps... so that's what a clean work space looks like, nice!

 

 

[Lochie]

On 5/8/2022 at 1:23 AM, AZ Fisher said:

 I know you're using an AB, but I thought some of this might help.

 I use a similar 2K auto clear, but I don't use an air brush. I use the spray gun.

 I had some orange peel issues when I started using the HVLP spray gun. It was pretty much a matter of getting the atomization of the droplets to the right consistency and the orange peel was minimized. This is easier with the HVLP gun than an AB IMHO. 

 Can we press down and pull back exactly the same,  each time with an air brush?  The trigger on the HVLP gun is pretty much on/off, not like an AB with the pressure increasing as you pull  back the trigger. Easier to maintain consistent air pressure/clear volume @ 29psi for correct atomization. 

  I also found that putting a very, very light tack coat on first and letting it flash off for 15 min before applying the second coat helped also.  After the 15 min flash off time, I will apply a heavier 2nd coat followed by 15 min of flash off and then a 3rd coat quite heavy. Depending on what bait I'm clearing, maybe a 4th and 5th coat.

 I have about one of the cheapest HVLP guns available but I can still get great results with it. I use the small  hobby gun pictured here. https://www.harborfreight.com/professional-automotive-hvlp-spray-gun-kit-94572.html 

I like having a pressure regulator inline just before the gun helped get me dialed in on maintaining the right consistent air pressure  @29psi . Should you go this route with an HVLP gun, and clearing a higher volume of baits, an airbrush compressor even with a tank won't be able to supply a large enough volume of air consistently without waiting for the comp to catch up. 

 Hope some of this helps... so that's what a clean work space looks like, nice!

 

 

Hey mate, thanks for the info. I wanted to let you know that I tried letting it flash off for a bit and that seemed to of fixed the orange peel so far. Thanks mate

[AZ Fisher]

8 hours ago, Lochie said:

Hey mate, thanks for the info. I wanted to let you know that I tried letting it flash off for a bit and that seemed to of fixed the orange peel so far. Thanks mate

Glad it helped, clear coats can be a PITA! 

[Lochie]

18 hours ago, AZ Fisher said:

Glad it helped, clear coats can be a PITA! 

 

18 hours ago, AZ Fisher said:

Glad it helped, clear coats can be a PITA! 

You are not wrong