goldenshinner Posted March 31, 2007 Report Share Posted March 31, 2007 stupid question. could anyone recomend the specific class of Propionate chemical composition that is best suited for lurebuilding? im looking to find an inexpensive score and found a local distributor(cheep) but i need to know which one.as i understand some are too brittle, or too hard, i think several will work, but is one better than the other? thanks 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hilo_Kawika Posted March 31, 2007 Report Share Posted March 31, 2007 I don't think this is a stupid question. It might be vinyl propionate but one approach might be to buy a small sample on EBay and have the local dealer see if they can determine which type of propionate it is. I'd sure be interested in the results! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobP Posted March 31, 2007 Report Share Posted March 31, 2007 Other types may work as well but I think most are using cellulose propionate disolved in acetone. An alternative is disolving Solo plastic cups in acetone. I use prop pellets for undercoating hardwood. IMO there are more durable choices for clearcoating. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doomdart Posted April 1, 2007 Report Share Posted April 1, 2007 Perhaps I should leave this for those who really know, but anyway: An alternative is disolving Solo plastic cups in acetone. I use prop pellets for undercoating hardwood. IMO there are more durable choices for clearcoating. I guess I hadn't read enough to know it would work with acetone. Only aware of virgin lacquer thinner solution with SOLO cup method. And I totally agree with BobP that there are better choices for clearcoating. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goldenshinner Posted April 1, 2007 Author Report Share Posted April 1, 2007 my interest is not in clearcoating but penetrating sealant. ive had ongoing problems with cracks etc that reach the wood base, causing failure. Does the cellulose propionate have another name, chemical formula, or trademark? and what is it normally manufactured for??? The Solo cup method is interesting, but it is atad too expensive. also I dont think the solo cups are actualy made of Propionate, but of some other soluabale plastic.I would love to get my hands on some n-itroCellulose as I understand that was what the original rapalas were made from. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swede Posted April 1, 2007 Report Share Posted April 1, 2007 i can supply you with propionate & some models of divinglips in same material if you want just pm me &we will go from there Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goldenshinner Posted April 2, 2007 Author Report Share Posted April 2, 2007 I was re-checking the solo cups. on sale A $2bag seems almost a pound weight worth! but looking on the bottom I see that several different classes of plastics are represented in the solo cup line. on the bottom of the cup I see a recylcling triangle with the number 1 PETE. and some others have a 6! neither is actualy propionate. any one know which is the useable type of cup? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheesehead Posted April 2, 2007 Report Share Posted April 2, 2007 Do yourself a favor and get some proprianate. I've tried both cups and silverware had them crack on me nearly a month later. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doomdart Posted April 2, 2007 Report Share Posted April 2, 2007 Do yourself a favor and get some proprianate. I've tried both cups and silverware had them crack on me nearly a month later. I have found the SOLO cup solution useful for certain applications. But still early and can't swear that it will hold up in the long run. If you go the cup route, buy the type that are semi-transparent (the soft kind). Don't get the hard plastic kind (whether clear or colored). Also, you don't have to buy the SOLO brand. As far as I know, the knock-offs work just as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rofish Posted April 2, 2007 Report Share Posted April 2, 2007 For the code system of reciclable plastics look here: http://www3.sympatico.ca/n.rieck/docs/plastic_codes.html As to the propionate pellets supplied by Swede, I could not find even the name for it. There 2 different stuffs: Cellulose acetate propionate, and Cellulose propionate. For CAP, look here: http://www.polymerweb.com/_datash/cp.html So, in order to find out which grade or class of propionate is best suited for a crankbait maker, he has first to know which one of the two materials he is looking for. The white plastic cups which dissolve in thinner/acetone are usually, but not necessarily made out of polystyrene, but I think the white cups are the worst choice to look for polystyrene. You could find polystyrene right under your nose, if you would look, for instance, at the transparent lid of a CD jewel case. But there are many other things which are made out of transparent polystyrene, which is a good sealer, but not the best choice for clearcoat. Some say epoxy (mainly Devcon) would be the best choice. I am stubborn enough to think that there are some other plastics which could be better than Devcon as clearcoat, but I have not yet discovered the right one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobP Posted April 2, 2007 Report Share Posted April 2, 2007 I haven't tried Solo cups but am using Swede's prop pellets (of whatever propionate type) disolved in acetone. It works fine as a waterproofer on raw wood and 6-7 fairly thin dip coats are strong enough to reinforce balsa. It dries in a few minutes so 6-7 dips take about an hour, then the lure is ready for further work. Faster than poly or epoxy. It is not crystal clear, nor can I speak for it's scratch resistance, so I use other stuff for clearcoating. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goldenshinner Posted April 2, 2007 Author Report Share Posted April 2, 2007 Do yourself a favor and get some proprianate. I've tried both cups and silverware had them crack on me nearly a month later. did you seal and finish coat with the cups, or just seal? I plan on an epoxi finish seal. im mianly interested in a penetrating sealer. perhaps I will have to devise some sort of comparison test between the styrene and the propianate.The Cd jewel case class of styrene interests me..im currious how the built up layers of paints and epoxi's bond to this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheesehead Posted April 2, 2007 Report Share Posted April 2, 2007 just sealed. 1 lure was sealed with black silverware and left as is. I would have thought it was caused by water but neither lure had been fished yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hazmail Posted April 30, 2007 Report Share Posted April 30, 2007 Cellulose Propionate Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hazmail Posted April 30, 2007 Report Share Posted April 30, 2007 Forgot to mention- use a coffee grinder (rotary) to smash up those Propionate pellets - more surface area means it disolves quicker. Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
parrothead127 Posted May 1, 2007 Report Share Posted May 1, 2007 There is a guy that posts on here that sells prop. cheap. Look on e-bay, that is where I found it. He lives in S. Carolina, and he has a great price on it. I bought some from him, it works great, dissolve in acetone. He ships super fast! He also has some great lure paints I bought from him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mar10 Posted August 27, 2012 Report Share Posted August 27, 2012 Hi guys, Firstly, apologies for resurecting an ancient thread. I am new to lure making and have read reams of info both here and on the net about sealing lures with dissolved cups, cutlery, cd's, old biros, baked beans, sabre tooth tiger testicles, ground down mummies etc, but I am wondering if there is a follow up to this or is everybody using the pellets supplied by Swede? Many thanks, Martin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mar10 Posted August 27, 2012 Report Share Posted August 27, 2012 Hi again guys, My post should have read like this but I hit the button too soon and cannot edit it: Firstly, hello to all and congratulations your work on keeping this such an informative site, also, apologies for resurrecting such an ancient thread. I am new to lure making and have read reams of info both here and on the net about sealing lures with dissolved cups, cutlery, cd's, old biros, baked beans, sabre tooth tiger testicles, ground down mummies etc, but I am wondering if there is a follow up to this or is everybody using the pellets supplied by Swede? At present I am using a wood hardener liquid used for treating soft and decayed timber which is okay but there must be a better and cheaper way? Many thanks, Martin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobP Posted August 27, 2012 Report Share Posted August 27, 2012 Swede passed away but I think Palmetto Balsa is also a source. PM him to find out. Propionate works well as an undercoat and is pretty cheap stuff compared to most alternatives. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wchilton Posted August 28, 2012 Report Share Posted August 28, 2012 I would love to get my hands on some n-itroCellulose as I understand that was what the original rapalas were made from. goldenshinner, Duco cement is nitrocellulose disolved in acetone. I haven't used it for coating or sealing so can't speak about how well it works. You'd probably have to thin it down as it is pretty thick. You can find it at Ace Hardware and other places that carry a variety of glues. Best price by ordering from Dick Blick art mart (dickblick.com). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
