Reproduction of older Lures

[Lenox2k]

Has anyone one here done any reproduction of older lures for their own pleasure or as a gift? Also would it be considered a No No to do so?

[Palmetto Balsa]

I have done baits similar to Boots Anderson's "Top Secret" and some "Big-O" types but I will always put a visible signature design (like a stenciled palmetto tree) on the bait prior to the clear coat. I don't think my baits could fool anybody but I don't want people rolling their eyes at me either.

As far as using the reproducing machines to copy a bait. I think that is a No No, but that is my opinion.

[BobP]

JMHO, if you're not doing it for commercial gain, copy anything you want. You can usually produce a better bait (straighter and more durable) as a custom builder than the original mass produced factory bait.

[Skeeter]

I agree with BobP.

Skeeter

[StoneCoal Tackle]

Yes I've copied old lures. Collecting vintage lures was what got me into lure making in the first place so about everything I make is based on old designs. Heck I don't know if I've ever had a truly original idea when it comes to lures.

I'm like Palmetto and Bob too, I always put my makers mark on my lures and even though I do sell a few lures it's not like I mass produce copies to get rich. I make all my lures for "my own pleasure". When it is no longer fun for me to make lures, I won't be making any more lures! Hey, maybe that should be my signature, LOL.

Here's a few pics of replicas that I've made:

There's a couple Creek Chub "Creek Bug Wigglers" that I made to fish with (still don't know how this shape dives and wiggles like it does)

There's a copy of the Hildreth "Wonder Bug" of the early 1960's, a true hand made lure that was a commercial success (my version is on the right and I've caught fish with it)

And there's a copy of a 1910 Alger "Bug Style Lure", made this one because I ain't paying $600 for a real one!!

So I say make'em, mark'em and don't try to fool anyone but the fish!

Carve on,

daymon

http://www.tackleunderground.com/photos/index.php?n=566

http://www.tackleunderground.com/photos/index.php?n=593

http://www.tackleunderground.com/photos/index.php?n=592

[Lenox2k]

Stonecoal To say Impressed with the work is mild, they are totaly great. What you are doing is just exactly the type i would love to make the older vintage style, not to fool or cheat they just seem to be things of beauty to me. Plus I do enjoy handcrafting. It looks like you do more hand painting than air brushing. What types of paint do you use mostly a oil base? This is a totaly new venture for me, have done a lot of hand turning since retiring but have gotton tired of doing pens and pepper grinders, and do-dads. Looks like what you are doing is a cmbo of both turning and hand carving? Thanks again

[StoneCoal Tackle]

Lenox, thanks for the kind words. I like all kinds of lures but the old school stuff is where it's at for me, I'm like you the vintage lures are little works of art, not to say the folks on here don't produce works of art because they sure do! I don't own an airbrush so my lures are either hand painted with a brush, sprayed with rattle cans or a combination of the two. As far as brush paints go I've used everything from acrylic craft paint to fingernail polish and for the rattle cans I'm mostly a "Krylon Man" LOL. I do turn on the lathe a lot and several of the lures I make are a combination of lathe and carving, like this Paw Paw Darter style lure. If you are a pen turner you'll pick up on the lures with no problem. I think you'll find a lot more room to flex your creativity with the lures too.

Good luck and post up some pics when you finish something.

Carve on,

daymon

[Florida Don]

Glad I found this thread as it is almost exactly 1 year old.

Anyhow, like lure making, I recently got into antique lure collecting. Got a few books and have found several I would like to copy.

Would it be possible to have an old lure collecting section on the forum? Or perhaps something on reproducing old lures?

If not, does anyone know of a forum that covers such topics?

Thanks,

[Legendary]

That would be great, I hope they can work something out. I love to see the antique lures they are so unusual and it makes you wonder how some people came up with these designs. I have been collecting for 15 years now and am always amazed when I look at them

[diemai]

Hi , Florida Don

I've also been making copies of vintage lures , just out of curiousity , how these would work , fore I had never seen such lures before over here in Germany . I made those lures after book pictures exclusively , after "Old Fishing Lures & Tackle" by Carl f. Luckey , mailordered that one from England years ago , but it is an American print .

Surely my lures did not turn out that beautiful like the ones shown here at TU , but it was great fun building them and off course catching fish on a few models of these:) .

Check The Hard Bait Database ,they have some lure-collectors links there , maybe , you'll find something there for yourself .

Regards , diemai

Edited April 14, 2008 by diemai
writing mistake

[Florida Don]

Diamai,

I just purchased the same book and a couple other's. I bought a few antique lures on eBay - mostly to see how they were made - what hardware etc. - and to learn by actually holding a grand them and looking at the workmanship.

Don't know how we can get a forum added, but I think it would be a good place to learn.

I did look in the hard baits section on TU and although I found some info, I think there is a need for something more specific. Off to check out the link you recommended - thanks!

Regardless, if anyone wishes to correspond with me regarding this - please PM me. I will be driving back to Florida Wednesday AM - so won't be on the computer until sometime Thursday - but I will get back to whomever writes.

[spare tire]

I like to make the old Nippies, for fishing, you just can't buy them like that anymore.

Thats what got me into this hobby

[Lure--Prof]

Copying is fine for your own use. It is counterfeiting that is a huge no-no, and enough of it goes on that it pays to know who you're dealing with when it comes to paying out the bigger bucks for antique lures. The National Fishing Lure Collectors Club, or NFLCC for short will be the first to tell you to keep your guard on at all times, and just because someone is an NFLCC member, is no guarantee that they're honest.

Anyone interested in collecting antique lures would do well to join the NFLCC, in my opinion; their vast aray of information sources are very easily worth the yearly dues if you think you might be buying some antique lures. For more information contact Home Page

Dean

[philB]

Hi

I dont have a definative answer to this question but I believe we are talking copyright here. I cannot imagine how you could copyright a lure as they are very similar in so many ways. In the US many lures have been copyrighted and I came across this link in a post on sponge lures on this site which has shed loads of copyrighted lures in PDF format which may be of interest.

[Vodkaman]

I think there is room for a tutorial on the subject. Bruce, can you scare someone into writing a lure renovation guide?

[philB]

Hi

Is there a difference between a 'Patent' and a 'Copyright' ???? I have been looking and reading some of the Patents on the link I posted previously and it seems that they are indeed encouraging the copy of the design. I always thought patents and copyrights were there to prevent copying

Here is a link to one that specificaly encourages the copy of the design.

http://www.vlasenko.ru/17901900/00295350.pdf

Edited April 15, 2008 by philB

[Spike-A-Pike]

I think there is room for a tutorial on the subject. Bruce, can you scare someone into writing a lure renovation guide?

I can try to find an author; perhaps a talking paper would be the way to approach this. The problem is that you can do all the practical research to dig up the information, but I wouldn't trust the information to be gospel. When going through my divorce 18 years ago, I found out the difference between an attorney that charges $120.00 an hour and the clown my x hired. There are changes to the laws all the time, some minor, some major, but you have to understand how the changes impact the entire process.

Lawyers have to make sure that laws change all the time; otherwise why would you retain their services??? (No Bucks, No Buck Rodgers)

[SmokeyJ]

Hi

Is there a difference between a 'Patent' and a 'Copyright' ???? I have been looking and reading some of the Patents on the link I posted previously and it seems that they are indeed encouraging the copy of the design. I always thought patents and copyrights were there to prevent copying

Here is a link to one that specificaly encourages the copy of the design.

http://www.vlasenko.ru/17901900/00295350.pdf

A good explanation of the differences between patents, trademarks and copyrights in the American legal tradition:

Copyright vs. Trademark vs. Patent

When it comes to lures, it gets hazy. For instance, Strike King is now marketing Coffee Tubes which I believe they have trademarked and probably copyrighted as well. Does this mean that no one else can market tubes with coffee scent? No, it just means they cannot market them as "Coffee Tubes". They can however, market them as tubes with coffee scent. When it comes to a lure design, if something is truly original one may be able to obtain a patent (costs a TON of money in legal fees, though), and that would prevent someone from copying the lure design for 20 years, after which the patent expires. However, if someone makes a variation of your lure with what a judge considers is a substantial change, no violation has occurred. This is why you will see trademarks and copyrights on lures fairly frequently to prevent theft of lure names and logos, etc., but you will pretty much never see someone suing over stealing a lure design.

[clemmy]

I personally do not reproduce older lures, but not for any ethical standards, but rather that my interest is developing new areas. Thay said, I have no problem with anyone reproducing a bait for profit, with 2 caveats: 1)I believe the bait should not be in current production and 2) you should say it's a repro, or "inspired by" or "my interpretation of.."

It's another thing alltogether to try to make an improvement upon an existing lure. I think (as long as not patented) that that's fair game.

Lastly, for personal use it should be fine, Just as it's fine to photocopy articles, etc. for personal/student use.

My 2 cents,

that, and another $3.58 will get you a gallon of gas...

Clemmy

[Florida Don]

I agree - but some lures can be legally reproduced as the patent has expired.

With my current talent level, I seriously doubt that my reproduction could pass for an original.

[Vodkaman]

As you know, I am dead against copying, so much new stuff to discover. But I really don't see the harm of resurrecting a few of the antique oldies. To test out the ideas of the day. Many of what I thought were new ideas, turned up on 70 year old lures, so some of the old quirks could find room in todays armoury.

[Florida Don]

I have no intention of ever selling one of my reproductions - and I doubt anyone would ever purchase one. One thing with collecting is that you had best know what you are purchasing. I know that people do try to sell a reproduction as an original, which is fraud plain and simple, but OTOH, the buyer best know what they are purchasing. It cuts both ways, what collector doesn't think from time to time that they just got the deal of a lifetime?

OTOH, if I were to come up with a combination of old and my ideas that became something of use, then I would have no problem marketing it - although I doubt that will ever happen.

In order for me to get something to reproduce, I have to purchase that item which I have just started to do. I have bought and sold other collectibles and will do so with lures when I am tired of having them. The saying of "history repeats itself" is so true. Take a look at other things such as golf items.

I respect your opinion, but feel that I am perfectly right in having my own one as well regarding copying an old lure. I do not feel that I am doing anything wrong or illegal - if that were the case, I wouldn't do it. But, unless someone can prove me wrong, I will continue to do so. Heck, half of the "new" soft plastics are knock-off's of one another.

Not to belabor the copyright issue, but it is my understanding that you can reproduce one of anything for personal use without infringing on any legal issue.

Anyhow, off to the shop to play with some lures.

[Vodkaman]

I am 100% behind you on this project and offer to help in any way I can. Good project. You should document the whole process with pictures. Many would be interested in viewing.