airbrush comparisons

[borderbasser]

I am interested in purchasing an airbrush. I want a quality gravity feed dual action brush but don't have a ton of money to spend. Currently I am looking at a Badger 100 and Badger Omni. I am also considering an Iwata Eclipse and possibly the HP-B. I basicly have two questions.

1. The Badgers are more in my price range, but was wondering for an extra $20-$30, would the Eclipse be a whole lot better? I hear a lot of people really talk up the Iwatas, and I'm sure rightly so, but at the $70 to $100 price range, will I really see a difference between the Eclipse and the Badgers? Of course I realize my skill level may really come into play here.

2. How would one compare the Eclipse to the HP-B? The HP-B is really more than I wanted to pay, but if it truly is that much better than the Eclipse, I might be willing to wait it out a while longer 'till I can save up the money.

On a side note (if it matters), I will be spraying water based paints like the ones from WASCO and maybe some Apple Barrels and am only interested in painting fairly large baits like swimbaits. Thanks guys for any suggestions.

TJ

[BobP]

I use a syphon feed Badger 175T and a gravity feed Iwata HP-B+. The Iwata's .02mm tip will not work with hobby paint like Apple Barrel. The HP is built to very fine tolerances and is great for fine shading and details but it clogs with anything but airbrush paint (containing smaller paint grains, flow enhancers). My opinion: gravity feed brushes spray better, use less paint, and are easier to clean. If you're buying one brush and want to use hobby paint, you need a larger tip, at least .05 mm. Even better, choose one that comes with several tips and needles. The brand won't matter as much as practice and experience with the brush you choose. You rarely hear anyone cursing their brush's quality or reliability, just the level of their own skill. Personally, I think the best airbrush deals are to had on Ebay.

[benton B]

I have the Iwata eclipse in both gravity and syphon feed. I love both but the gravity feed is the winner hands down for ease of use and cleaning. It has a slightly smaller tip at .035 and the syphon feed is .05mm. You can't go wrong with the Iwata brand. but the badger users are going to tell you the same thing. Both brands make quality equip.

[rofish]

Just asking. I do not have an airbrush, so I don't know much about them.

But a diameter of, let's say, .05 mm means 5 hundreds of a milimeter, which is very, very small. Could it be 0.5 mm you are talking about?

[benton B]

Ro, I think you are correct on that, I've got an added 0 that does not belong .5 mm for the syphon feed eclipse and .35 mm for the gravity feed model.

[BobP]

Yes, sorry. The Eclipse is .35mm, the HP's are .2 mm. BTW, another question that comes up on Iwata gravity feed brushes is which size cup do you need. I use a HP-B with 1/8 oz cup and it holds plenty of paint for crankbait painting. I'm often dropping only 4-5 drops of paint into the cup for a particular color shot. Even for white basecoating, I rarely use more than half a cup of paint on bass lures.

[RiverMan]

I am on either my 4th or 5th airbrush and have no intention of replacing the brush I have now.........gravity feed Iwata, simply the best!

RM

[rjbass]

There is no comparison, Iwata gravity feed is a dream. Smooth painting with great atomizing and super easy to clean. You won't be sorry if you spend the extra money.

Rod

[dampeoples]

I've got a HP-B+ as well, as per Bob's recommendation. I am, however, seriously considering the brush Marty uses as a spare/workhorse rig, due to the water based paint I use. It's good paint, but that needle is awfully small, and if the little larger nozzle will help with the aggravation of the tip clogging, i'm all for it!

[borderbasser]

Thanks guys for the responses. But back to my second question, how would yall compare the Eclipse and the HP-B? What makes the HP-B worth the extra money?

[BobP]

You usually get what you pay for. I think the high price of the HP comes from its smaller nozzle and needle, which are machined to a fine tolerance and then hand tuned at the factory. If you saw an HP nozzle you'd understand. It's half the size of an uncooked grain of rice. I love my HP but also have a Badger 175T for color basecoating and large size shots. If I could own only one airbrush and it came down to a choice between the 2 Iwatas, the Eclipse with its .35mm tip might be the better choice based on the above info. Now dampeoples is gonna be mad at me.

[dampeoples]

Yeah, now I gotta buy another brush!

For reference, that's what the tech support guy told me the other day when I put a call into them for a problem. They ae very helpful people, the guy even waited patiently while I found the lost part I was sitting on

[Lure--Prof]

Thanks guys for the responses. But back to my second question, how would yall compare the Eclipse and the HP-B? What makes the HP-B worth the extra money?

Border, I'm not sure what you're asking: My Eclipse is model HP-BS (1/16th oz. gravity cup). The $20 to $30 price jump in the Eclipse line is between the less expensive siphon feed, and the higher gravity feed models.

Dean

[rofish]

I think there is some misunderstanding here, at least from my part.

See what they sell here. Click on the Eclipse series and the High performance fized nozzles:

http://www.dixieart.com/Iwata_Airbrush_Main.html

[VMAXX]

I use the eclipse in the siphon feed and for small detail work I change the needle and cone from the .5 to the .35 (out of the gravity feed eclipse) In the future I will be looking at a gravity feed....hindsight . I will also mention when I first bought my eclipse it came with the .5 and I tried it and panicked...I couldnt use it thats when I went and bought the .35 for it...since then I've went back to the .5 and (practice,prac,prac) learned to use it with no problems with a little practice it will do 99% of what you'll need.

[BobP]

Rofish, the "High Performance Fixed Nozzle" brushes you cite are the Iwata HP series (HP-A, B, etc), not the Eclipse. High Performance=HP

I wouldn't hesitate to buy any Iwata, just pick a nozzle size. The Eclipse is .35 mm, Revolution .3 mm, and the HP .2 mm. If there is an alternative nozzle size for the Eclipse, that is a plus (I don't see it on Dixie Art). The HP's come only in .2 mm. None come with an air hose, which costs $18 from Iwata. I like the Paasche air hose because they're limp and easy to use (and I already had one), so I bought an inexpensive adapter from Dixie Art.

[Lure--Prof]

Bob,

Iwata is certainly not helping us out here, but here is what is confusing everyone: Eclipses are part of the HP series also. All the brushes we are discussing are part of the HP series. I have an Eclipse HP-BS. What you are calling the HP series is actually the HP Plus or HP Hi-line which are the fixed nozzles that Rofish is talking about...which are the more expensive HP's, closer to $200 than the $100 range Eclipse HP's.

V-Max,

are you saying .5 when you mean to be saying .2? .5 would be bigger than .35. I thought .35 was their largest

Phew,

Dean

[VMAXX]

WOW is everybody's head spinning like mine:eek: LOL! No Dean I made it worse when I said anything:lol: anyway I have an Eclipse HP-BCS which is the siphon feed eclipse it comes standard with the .5 needle(gravity feed eclipse's come standard with .35) however after I bought it I panicked because I couldnt control the flow very well compared to the paasche I was used to with the .3? needle so I contacted IWATA and found out the needle,cone,crown cap for the gravity feed eclipse's(standard .35) will also fit the siphpon feed(BCS)....later after a little seat time with the .5 I've learned it will do almost everything I need without the.35 and could have saved myself about $30.00

Now I think that's it;)

I will say coming from a paasche to an IWATA was a eye opener the .35 cone with the machined tip is a thing of beauty:yay:

[borderbasser]

Ok guys, I sure thank ya for the responses. I may be a little more confused than I was before though LOL! So let me be a little more specific. What sets this brush apart (94 ECL4500 Eclipse CS: $109.97) from this brush (: 94 H2001 HP-B PLUS 159.00).

[VMAXX]

Rofish, the "High Performance Fixed Nozzle" brushes you cite are the Iwata HP series (HP-A, B, etc), not the Eclipse. High Performance=HP

Actually Bob the eclipes are also HP series, the difference between the eclipse, plus, high line series is the designation at the end of the model(besides the obvious mechanical)

ie: Eclipse (siphon feed)= HP-BCS

Plus series(siphon feed)= HP-BC PLUS

Hi-line(no siphon feed) =HP-AH

The lower line Iwata's(Revolution's) also carry 2 models with the HP prefix

[VMAXX]

Borderbasser go to this site to learn more than you probably want to know lol

http://www.iwata-medea.com/products/airbrush/micron/cmb_info.jsp

[Lure--Prof]

VMAXX,

at least we both told Bob the same thing!

and Border, at least I know what you're talking about now...Bob offered good advice, if you now know what he's talking about!

Dean

[VMAXX]

Sorry Dean did'nt mean to repeat! LOL

Stacey

[Lure--Prof]

Thats okay Stacy, I feel pretty great about both of us sharing the same knowledge, the way this thread's been going!

Dean

[VMAXX]

Ok guys, I sure thank ya for the responses. I may be a little more confused than I was before though LOL! So let me be a little more specific. What sets this brush apart (94 ECL4500 Eclipse CS: $109.97) from this brush (: 94 H2001 HP-B PLUS 159.00).

BorderB. the biggest difference I can see is the plus will come with a .2mm and the 4500 will come with the .35mm, I can't speak for everybody but my experience has been with createx auto air and a .35 needle and I have had problems with the pearls and the iridescents I cant imagine trying them with a .2mm and any type of hobby paint, if you were to get the 4500 you would have the ability to go up to a .5 if needed for the bigger pigments in the hobby type paint....just my .02:)